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Posted by: SFJCody Jun 18 2004, 07:02 AM

Following in the footsteps of Mongo's discovery in the Phoebe thread, I have tried a few more possible image file names.

Here's a pic of Titan looking a bit like 19th/ early 20th century drawings of Mars (sans canali):

http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/ir/2004/202_217_2.png

Posted by: Sunspot Jun 18 2004, 09:32 AM

Thats probably going to be todays picture lol

Where are all the pictures of the rings? They seem to be releasing lots of pictures of those tiny storms in the atmosphere, but arguably Saturns most famous feature has been neglected.

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 18 2004, 09:52 AM

I found 9 uncaptioned images in total.

1 of Titan

7 of Saturn's atmosphere and/or rings through various filters.

1 of Iapetus.

Posted by: Sunspot Jun 18 2004, 10:31 AM

Do you have the links to them?

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 18 2004, 01:14 PM

Wait... make that 6 uncaptioned images of Saturn. Another one has been captioned:

http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=147

Posted by: pioneer Jun 18 2004, 02:15 PM

Cassini has taken an image of Iaepetus? Where's the link?

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 19 2004, 07:58 AM

Atmospheric Detail in Infrared
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/145_191_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=145

Moon under Saturn
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/144_192_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=144

Rings and Moons
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/149_181_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=149

Saturn's Atmosphere and Rings
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/142_186_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=142

South Pole on Saturn
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/134_182_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=134

Southern Hemisphere in Ultraviolet
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/162_176_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=162

Saturn's Yin-Yang Moon
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/151_173_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=151

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 20 2004, 05:15 PM

That is a great shot of Vallis Cassiniaris (our informal name for the major dark feature seen in the unreleased Titan image). I am currently working on putting together a map of Titan based on images just like this from 88 km/pixel down to around 35 km/pixel which should be released around SOI.

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 20 2004, 05:16 PM

That feature can also be seen in my avatar

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 20 2004, 05:34 PM

Vallis Cassiniaris... nice name!

Are there any good shots of Rhea yet Jason? I'd imagine the wispy features would be coming into view now.

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 21 2004, 04:49 PM

D'oh, I forgot to check those this morning. I'm at a Workshop for Phoebe right now.

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 21 2004, 07:29 PM

Just took a look at the Rhea images. Not much really to see. IIt appears fairly bright with a bright spot near the terminator that's about 15% of the visible surface. It is approximately located at 20S, 120W.

Posted by: Sunspot Jun 21 2004, 10:30 PM

How come we can't see them?

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 21 2004, 10:47 PM

Because it just isn't publically available. Unfortunately I doubt it ever will. It really isn't that spectacular of an image. All I can see in almost all filters is a bright world with phase ~70degrees with a brighter spot as mentioned. If there is a place where you have a right to complain, it would be the lack of color Saturn images. None have been released in quite a long time and even I'm getting ansy.

Posted by: Pando Jun 21 2004, 10:58 PM

I'm wondering who sits on the high chair and makes the determination what is and isn't worth releasing to the public, spectacular image or not...

I'd say they should release all images and let the public decide if it's spectacular or not. Must funding comes from the public one way or the other. We should see all the results.

But thanks volcanopele for giving us tidbits what goes on inside...

Posted by: Sunspot Jun 22 2004, 08:42 AM

The strange thing is I keep hearing quotes from the cassini team how spectacular this mission is going to be, perhaps they were speaking on a personal level as i'm sure it will be for them.

.....oh well, I guess i'll just have to go back to browsing through the MER images.

Big batch of Spirit pics just arrived at exploratorium .

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 22 2004, 09:12 AM

It looks like there's a bright spot/streak on the Voyager [USGS] map at that location. But the most prominent feature on the leading hemisphere is Tirawa crater in the north (which should be entirely in darkness if 20S, 120W is at the terminator).

Tirawa was poorly imaged by the Voyagers. It should be interesting to see this feature coming slowly into view over the next week and a half.


Sunspot/Pando: It is *their* instrument. I think it's only fair that they get first dibs on the data. I don't think some kind of automated JPEG-isation a la MER is a suitable option and I don't think it would be a worthwhile use of their time to sort through thousands upon thousands of images purely to decide which ones are suitable for public release.

I nominate myself for this thankless task...

Posted by: Sunspot Jun 22 2004, 09:49 AM

Too late, i've already nominated myself for that task

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Jun 22 2004, 10:42 AM

I'm not sure there are going to be interesting satellite images (except for Titan and Phoebe) until October although some images may be obtained after SOI. The reason is that Cassini is about to enter a week+ long 'quiet period' preceding SOI. During this time no remote sensing will be done and the spacecraft stays Earth-pointed until a few hours before SOI.

The real fun with Cassini imagery may not start until a year from now when the raw data gets released. The public releases so far have been really disappointing IMHO, except for the Phoebe flyby. I'm especially surprised at the lack of spectacular color images (both true and false color) of Saturn and the rings and how old all of the Saturn images are. This contrasts strongly with the Jupiter flyby.

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 22 2004, 10:54 AM

<Annoyed grunt>, of course! Ah well, at least I'm not missing anything. Jason, what are the plans for satellite imaging in the week following SOI?

Posted by: xflare Jun 22 2004, 12:33 PM

The Phoebe images were stunning, but images they've released of the planet have been a little dull. The images taken showing the whole planet and rings in color are VERY nice though. And the latest image (21/6) is over 5 weeks old lol

True it might be "their" camera, but its like being invited to an amzazing party and then being asked to stand outside and watch it through a window. Just feel a little dissapointed after waiting 7 years thats all.

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 22 2004, 02:16 PM

I'm really annoyed by the week long gap in Titan coverage. Our images will jump from the 35 km/pixel data taken today and 2 km/pixel data that will be taken July 2. As far as post-SOI coverage, I'm not sure beyond The images on the 2nd and the Very-hires rings images. I know though that we will be coming reasonably close to Mimas and we will not be taking images

Posted by: Mongo Jun 22 2004, 03:27 PM

None? That's a shame, as it will be almost a year before the next close flyby of Mimas (15 April 2005), and that flyby will not be as close as this one. I had first thought that Cassini would be too close to Titan to spare time for Mimas, but the closest approach to Titan will be 33 hours after the closest approach to Mimas, which should leave plenty of time for re-targeting the ISS.

The ascending ring crossing is only 17 minutes after closest approach to Mimas, so that may be a factor in the planning, but I think the biggest factor is that this will be the closest approach to Saturn in the entire Baseline Mission, and the decision must have been made that observing Saturn and its rings at close range is a higher priority than observing Mimas--which has better observation opportunities later, starting with the third flyby in 02 August 2005, at barely half the distance of this one (45112 km vs. 76801 km), and less than one-third of the relative velocity (6.5 km/s vs. 22.4 km/s).

Bill

Posted by: xflare Jun 22 2004, 04:56 PM

LOL & todays picture release:

http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=151&www=6e450599290fd06e1831b8a4a2088137

Is that really going to fire up the publics interest?

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 22 2004, 05:25 PM

It looks like these will be the remaining images through to June 30th (not including Special Releases).


Atmospheric Detail in Infrared
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/145_191_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=145

Moon under Saturn
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/144_192_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=144

Saturn's Atmosphere and Rings
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/142_186_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=142

South Pole on Saturn
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/134_182_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=134

Southern Hemisphere in Ultraviolet
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/dr/2004/162_176_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=162

Through the Haze (I think Jason's map will accompany this image)
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/ir/2004/202_217_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=202

Posted by: Pando Jun 22 2004, 06:44 PM

Exactly, plus you have a ticket to that party in your hand that you already paid for...

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 22 2004, 07:10 PM

... and every so often someone opens the door and hands you a cocktail stick with cubes of cheese and pineapple on it and expects you to be happy.

Posted by: remcook Jun 23 2004, 02:36 PM

Check this out!

http://uanews.org/cgi-bin/WebObjects/UANews.woa/wa/SRStoryDetails?ArticleID=9288

nice video clip too!

ah- i see it's nothing new about titan (see:http://eso.org/outreach/press-rel/pr-2004/pr-09-04.html)

Posted by: Mongo Jun 24 2004, 10:32 PM

volcanopele, the map of Titan that you are currently working on has a resolution of 88-35 km/pixel, while existing maps from HST or ground-based telescopes have a resolution of 350 km/pixel at best. Given the increase in resolution, is there a big difference in understanding what you are seeing in the way of surface features? For example, the feature that your group is calling "Vallis Cassiniaris" and another group has nicknamed "Lying H". Is the resolution good enough yet to determine the physical nature of this feature? Or will that have to wait for the ~2 km/pixel images?

Bill

p.s. I assume that "Valles Cassiniaris" is being named in honor of "Valles Marineris", but since "Merineris" is simply "Mariner" with "-is" added, shouldn't the feature be called "Valles Cassiniis", or whatever the proper Latin would be?

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 25 2004, 04:01 AM

Our map does show features that the Keck or ESO maps don't show. You'll find out more June 29th or June 30th. I apologize for being vague, but I can't really help it. As far as having a better understanding, well, we just aren't seeing much of anything that appears to be impact-related. If I were to saying anything about the "Vallis Cassinis" image,it would be that the dark terrain appears to be tectonically controlled. Now whether Vallis Cassinis (or Cassiniaris, it's an unofficial name, who really cares at this point) is a canyon so that it warrants the adjective Vallis is unknown, I just started calling it that because of its similarity in appearance with Vallis Marineris. Vallis Cassinis will be covered in the 2 km/pixel coverage next Friday. Maybe we will have a better handle then.

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 25 2004, 05:00 PM

Saturn color image coming today along with the previously mentioned Titan image of Vallis Cassinis. However, the color image is from like May 7

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 25 2004, 05:26 PM

scratch that, the Saturn color image is not as far along (caption wise) as I thought. I'm not going to be the one who posts it but lets just say it is findable

Posted by: David Jun 25 2004, 05:32 PM

Possible correct forms of a name meaning "Cassini Valley" are:
Vallis/Valles Cassini "Valley *of* Cassini"
Vallis/Valles Cassiniana "Cassinian Valley"

Valles is an acceptable singular, but Vallis seems to be more often used in astronomical nomenclature, perhaps because it is more clearly distinguished from the plural form, which is always _valles_.
If Valles (plural) is to be used as the name of a system of valleys, then one would say:
Valles Cassini "Valleys of Cassini"
Valles Cassinianae "Cassinian Valleys"

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 25 2004, 05:42 PM

I think this thread should now be taken up with speculation->

Titan- Tectonic rifting? Active cryo-volcanism? Icy fold belts? Rivers, lakes or seas? Tholin gunk? Layers of fresh and 'dirty' ices? Strange polar features? Calderas filled with ammonia-water eutectic melt? Pedestal craters? Palimpsests? Geysers?


Maybe Titan will have cryo-volcanic 'coronae' like Venus... or it could turn out to be a clone of Ganymede.

Posted by: David Jun 25 2004, 06:16 PM

Maybe something like this:



http://www.frankwu.com/Paul-113.5.html

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 25 2004, 07:34 PM

I think this willl end up having an unusual amount of endogenic activity with tectonic landforms being the dominant terrain. Now this is completely speculation, so don't think that we can see these yet. I would anticipate dry river beds (much like here in Tucson where they call ditches rivers). I would expect that the albedo shadings are coorelated to the amount of water ice exposed. Xanadu, being the brightest feature, might have a large precentage of its surface being exposed ice, both by being at a higher elevation (thus allowing a downslope movement of haze particles) and through enhanced cratering activity due to being on the leading hemisphere. The intermediate albedo terrain maybe mostly covered in haze particles but not that many crater lakes. Finally the dark terrain may be a high percentage of crater lakes, a thicker deposit of haze particles, endogenic material produced by tectonism/volcanism, or an actual sea.

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 25 2004, 09:02 PM

If there are rivers/river beds I expect the largest one will be named Alph...


In Xanadu did Kubla Khan
A stately pleasure-dome decree:
Where Alph, the sacred river, ran
Through caverns measureless to man
Down to a sunless sea.



I doubt there are many 'surface' seas more sunless than those on Titan (if they exist).

Posted by: pioneer Jun 25 2004, 09:13 PM

You mean you all haven't seen many craters caused by meteorite impacts?

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 25 2004, 10:40 PM

depends....

EDIT: Let me clarify. We haven't had any unambiguous detections of craters. We have some issues with S/N so that limits our ability at this resolution to detect features that are a few percent above the surrounding terrain.

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 25 2004, 10:44 PM

cool thanks for the name idea. I think we have bright albedo feature, rivers, and crater names down pat. What I want to know is does anyone know any good names for the dark areas. Here are the guidelines:

Legendary/mythical primordial seas or enchanted waters from world cultures

Posted by: Mongo Jun 26 2004, 12:06 AM

Let's see, we have the five rivers of the Greek underworld:

the Acheron (river of woe)
the Cocytus (river of lamentation)
the Phlegethon (river of fire)
the Styx (river of unbreakable oath by which the gods swear)
the Lethe (river of forgetfulness)

An equivalent in the Norse mythology would be the Gioll, a river surrounding the Lower World.

The Mesopotamian equivalent of this river would be the Hubur:

Copied from http://www.ancientneareast.net/religion_mesopotamian/cosmology/abzu.html:

According to ancient Mesopotamian belief, the Abzu (or engur) was the vast freshwater ocean that lay beneath the earth (as opposed to the salt sea, which was thought to surround the earth). The Abzu therefore served as the source of all wells, springs, rivers, streams and lakes.

The Abzu was the domain of the god Enki (Ea), his consort Damgalnuna (Damkina) and his mother Nammu, as well as being the home of a number of his peculiar creatures. (Enki was believed to have ruled the Abzu prior to mankind's creation). The temple of Enki at Eridu was known as E-Abzu, "the house, or temple, of the Abzu".

On another level, according to the Babylonian Epic of Creation, Apsû was a primal being, the lover of Tiamat. After Ea's killing of Apsû, he erected his dwelling on Apsû's body, the dead creature's name being transferred thereafter to Ea's residence. As Ea's son, Marduk was often designated "firstborn son of the apsû".

The Underworld was located beneath the Abzu. Occasionally, it seems, the Abzu was identified with a river (the Hubur) that one had to cross in order to reach the Underworld.

Hope that this is helpful...

Bill

Posted by: volcanopele Jun 26 2004, 12:10 AM

The rivers of the Greek underworld are also in the Divine Comedy by Dante, which is a source for names on Io. I really want to see these turned into mountains on Io.

The Abzu suggestion though is very good. I will add that to my list.

Posted by: David Jun 26 2004, 12:26 AM

The seven legendary oceans of the Indian Vedas are:

Lavana
Ikshu
Sura
Sarpi
Dadhi
Dugdha
Jala

I don't know if these names have been used in the planetographical nomenclature of other bodies, but I don't recall having seen them.

Posted by: David Jun 26 2004, 12:59 AM

And the primordial sea in Avestan (Zoroastrian) mythology is called Vourukasha.

Posted by: Mongo Jun 26 2004, 01:02 AM

The Egyptian primordial sea was called Nun (or Nu):

Bill

Posted by: SFJCody Jun 26 2004, 06:37 AM

More images:

Ringworld Waiting
Image:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/ir/2004/205_222_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=205

The May 7th colour picture?



[untitled]
Image 1:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/ir/2004/206_224_2.png
Image 2:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/media/ir/2004/206_225_2.png
Caption:
http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=206