Cape York - Shoemaker Ridge and the NE traverse, Starting sol 2735 |
Cape York - Shoemaker Ridge and the NE traverse, Starting sol 2735 |
Nov 4 2011, 05:39 PM
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#346
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Senior Member Group: Moderator Posts: 3431 Joined: 11-August 04 From: USA Member No.: 98 |
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Nov 4 2011, 06:19 PM
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#347
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Senior Member Group: Moderator Posts: 3431 Joined: 11-August 04 From: USA Member No.: 98 |
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Nov 4 2011, 07:43 PM
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#348
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Senior Member Group: Admin Posts: 4763 Joined: 15-March 05 From: Glendale, AZ Member No.: 197 |
I overlaid Bill's colors on the base MI image and came up with these rough composites. The L257 has a desaturated section on the left where the IDD arm joint was intruding into the color image.
-------------------- If Occam had heard my theory, things would be very different now.
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Nov 4 2011, 07:46 PM
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#349
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The Poet Dude Group: Moderator Posts: 5551 Joined: 15-March 04 From: Kendal, Cumbria, UK Member No.: 60 |
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Nov 4 2011, 07:51 PM
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#350
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Chief Assistant Group: Admin Posts: 1409 Joined: 5-January 05 From: Ierapetra, Greece Member No.: 136 |
wow! That looks
-------------------- photographer, space imagery enthusiast, proud father and partner, and geek.
http://500px.com/sacred-photons & |
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Nov 4 2011, 08:36 PM
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#351
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3648 Joined: 1-October 05 From: Croatia Member No.: 523 |
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Nov 4 2011, 10:06 PM
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#352
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Chief Assistant Group: Admin Posts: 1409 Joined: 5-January 05 From: Ierapetra, Greece Member No.: 136 |
and even better... almost looks like a calibrated image Ugordan, what is it you do?
-------------------- photographer, space imagery enthusiast, proud father and partner, and geek.
http://500px.com/sacred-photons & |
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Nov 4 2011, 10:29 PM
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#353
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3648 Joined: 1-October 05 From: Croatia Member No.: 523 |
First I try to get the filter combination to look like what I *think* the calibrated representation would look like, which for the L456 set looks more like a dark brownish-red color for the dust and soil. Then I run that through some code that linearly interpolates between the 3 wavelengths and uses the CIE XYZ formula to generate sRGB outputs. This converts the scene to the familiar rusty orange color for dust and soil - here's a comparison on an early mission sundial snapshot. Final step is then conversion to default sRGB colorspace for web output.
The simple linear interpolation is less sophisticated than a polynomial fit if you have more than 3 filters, but I found it perfectly adequate if the starting filter set is already pretty close to "red", "green" and "blue" colors as is the case with L456. It does a lousy job with L257 stuff on the other hand because the surface spectra is not that flat. -------------------- |
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Nov 4 2011, 11:08 PM
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#354
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Member Group: Members Posts: 701 Joined: 3-December 04 From: Boulder, Colorado, USA Member No.: 117 |
Lots of outstanding images of a remarkable feature! Given how it's standing up, wonder if Oppy could break off a piece by driving over it, to get a fresh surface?
John |
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Nov 4 2011, 11:18 PM
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#355
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3516 Joined: 4-November 05 From: North Wales Member No.: 542 |
The 'true colour' thing is really difficult. For a start everyone's looking at different monitors which represent the colours differently. Just walk past a television shop to verify this. Of course that goes also for the persons creating the images. But there is another factor that I think is even more significant, and that is the adjustment the human eye makes to the ambient colour scheme. This acts to compensate for an overall colour bias in a scene, moderating the perceived colours.
Gordan already knows how much I respect his judgment in these matters so I hope he won't mind me saying that actually I find Stu's colours (as viewed on my monitor) more 'believable' in this case. |
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Nov 4 2011, 11:22 PM
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#356
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Chief Assistant Group: Admin Posts: 1409 Joined: 5-January 05 From: Ierapetra, Greece Member No.: 136 |
I look at these images on an ~sRGB monitor and one that displays ~aRGB and still Gordan's colors (and overall contrast, etc...) look more like the ones on the Pancam site..
-------------------- photographer, space imagery enthusiast, proud father and partner, and geek.
http://500px.com/sacred-photons & |
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Nov 4 2011, 11:28 PM
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#357
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3516 Joined: 4-November 05 From: North Wales Member No.: 542 |
wonder if Oppy could break off a piece by driving over it, to get a fresh surface? I like it! In the past I've advocated deliberately using the wheels to knock things over and look underneath but I never got a seconder for the proposal. Let's see what happens this time. |
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Nov 4 2011, 11:49 PM
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#358
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3516 Joined: 4-November 05 From: North Wales Member No.: 542 |
I look at these images on an ~sRGB monitor and one that displays ~aRGB and still Gordan's colors (and overall contrast, etc...) look more like the ones on the Pancam site.. Yeah. The images on the pancam site don't look 'right ' to me either. I think that's because when I view them I'm not surrounded by 4 pi steradians of Martian landscape. Rather I'm surrounded by a room full of Earthly ambient light. To someone with eyes adjusted to this the Martian scene may indeed look strongly orange-brown. But if you actually went to Mars your eyes would compensate and the perceived colours would shift towards the neutral. I think that's what Stu is trying to represent. (If not no doubt he will correct me.) |
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Nov 5 2011, 12:07 AM
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#359
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Chief Assistant Group: Admin Posts: 1409 Joined: 5-January 05 From: Ierapetra, Greece Member No.: 136 |
somehow (based on some readings; the reproduction of colour by Hunt), I was thinking the colors look oversaturated in photographs just because of the fact photographs are confined to 'a box' surrounded by other light, contrast, etc.. but that in reality, the scene, if observed in real time 'in situ', is just as vivid, only it doesn't strike as being so vivid because it's 'all around you' and adaptation to pure white has alot to do with it. I hope Gordan or others could help me out/correct me on this if I'm wrong.
-------------------- photographer, space imagery enthusiast, proud father and partner, and geek.
http://500px.com/sacred-photons & |
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Nov 5 2011, 12:30 AM
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#360
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3648 Joined: 1-October 05 From: Croatia Member No.: 523 |
I don't want to derail this thread any more by getting into another discussion on color which won't really change anyone's mind so this will be my last comment. I never claimed that particular image is really "true" color. The way Pancam DN encoding works, how the raw stretch is applied to both darks and brights in each image, the huge amount of dust on the lens, often significantly varying surface lighting conditions and lacking any stable color reference point in the frame, it's really impossible to claim any accuracy using the raw images. I'm not terribly satisfied with how that image turned out, actually.
Nigel has a point about adaptation to the general hue of the scene, but that doesn't mean color variation is lost to the eye as well. If anything, it should be more noticeable once the overall hue "bias" is removed. Yet I often see images posted where people focus on the overall hue and in the process accidentally destroy color variation in the scene, making the product almost look like colorized monochrome. -------------------- |
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