Journey to Mt Sharp - Part 5: Into the Valleys, Sol 706-752, Aug 1-Sep 17, 2014 Options

[fredk]

Toe-dip into the Hidden Valley ripples on 706:


...Maybe a good time for a new thread?

[elakdawalla]

I think it's time for a new topic! It looks like we have indeed arrived in Hidden Valley, ending the southward drive from the Kimberley. It's time to take a right turn, heading west-southwest in valley floors, paralleling the black basaltic dunes, until we reach Murray Buttes.

[walfy]

Descent into the valley!

[anticitizen2]

Part 5: Into the Valleys

The subtitle gave me goosebumps

Quick 2 image anaglyph album

Stretched

[elakdawalla]

The subtitle gave me goosebumps

Just investing this adventure with the drama it deserves

[djellison]

705 Toe Dip!

(Full Size - http://dougellison.smugmug.com/Landscapes/...ity/i-QRFgw57/O )

Attached thumbnail(s)

 

[nprev]

What a scene!!! That big layered guy with the white highlight at 1 o'clock from the POV is just begging for a close-up...the surrounding dunes look a bit forbidding, though.

[jmknapp]

Not much slippage per the speed plot and the track above looks good.

[Ant103]

My take on this wonderful view

[CosmicRocker]

Toe-dip

It looks like we made a favorable "first impression."

[Phil Stooke]

This is a circular version of Damia's mosaic from sol 706.

Phil

[mhoward]

Just investing this adventure with the drama it deserves

I think you nailed the title. I'm going to borrow that one, if you don't mind.

[elakdawalla]

Considering just how much I'm relying on your website for my book, I certainly don't mind!

[Phil Stooke]

This is the sol 705 pan from the most recent press release, in circular form.

Phil

[mhoward]

I certainly don't mind!

Thanks; it's good to know that it's useful.

[craigmcg]

I seems appropriate that Curiosity will be spending much of August on the beach.

[elakdawalla]

I moved several wheel-related posts to the Monitoring wheel changes over time thread.

[elakdawalla]

Hmmm. Wondering if we're seeing another excessive slip event on sol 709. If it is, it doesn't look as excessive as the one back on sol 672.

[fredk]

I suppose this will be the kind of view we have for a while...

Sure makes you appreciate the usefulness of orbital imagery.

[PDP8E]

what is this little valley?
ancient riverbed? (will there be cobbles in the banks?)
a rift?
just wondering...

[jvandriel]

Sol 706
Hidden Valley

Jan van Driel

[PaulH51]

Wondering if we're seeing another excessive slip event on sol 709. If it is, it doesn't look as excessive as the one back on sol 672.

The drive distances published by Joe and Midnight Planets (MP) are rarely aligned as MP reports point-to-point movement, with Joe reporting the drive distance using NAIF wheel turn data that includes donuts during the drive. Looking at the images we have so far, the sol 709 drive appears straight with one partial donut (turn) at the beginning of the drive. Comparing the distances 14.1m by MP and 26m from Joe along with the spacing of the marks left by the cleats in the wheel track it appears we have had some slip, but apparently not enough to trigger a halt in the drive which looks like good news for a traverse through these valley systems. I note that this drive took the rover closer to the southern wall of the valley, HiRISE images suggest the ripples are smaller on that side of the valley I wonder if they would offer less slip? Or it could just be that the southern wall is not as steep as the north wall and could be used to exit the floor if required.

[Gerald]

Part of this press release sounds almost like the announcement of a waypoint:

...an appetizer outcrop of a base layer of the mountain lies ... less than one-third of a mile (500 meters) from Curiosity. The rover team is calling the outcrop "Pahrump Hills." ...

[elakdawalla]

Hmmmmm. I'd buy that. "Appetizer" sounds like they're thinking about eating something

[Phil Stooke]

My interpretation of the final waypoint from the original waypoint map was that it was on this same valley floor unit, so I think this may just be the first exposure of the same unit along this new path.

Phil

[jmknapp]

Check the speed plot from this drive--it looks like maybe slip detection kicked in at t=1850. The way I'm interpreting such data anyway is that spikes of more than a few cm/sec represent slip, and those usually occur (if they do) at the beginning of a drive pulse (makes sense I guess). Usually the slip is short-lived and the rover continues forward but at 1850 there's no action after the big pulse of 45 cm. That's still just a fraction of a rotation of the wheel. But then it seems to proceed OK. There was some zig-zagging at the end, at least according to the raw SPICE data:



Never sure how much to take that as gospel though.

[Phil Stooke]

A very rough circular view to get our current location:



Phil

[Gerald]

Check the speed plot from this drive--it looks like maybe slip detection kicked in at t=1850.

The time for the pause seems to match with this NavCam Left B image. So I'm considering, that the stop (at t=1850) has been intentional to do some imaging.
The last driving phase took about 600s, like the one before. This gives me some hope, that the termination of the drive hasn't been triggered by slipping, presuming periodic imaging stops.
But when looking at the right front wheel (driving backward), there may be an augmented risk of excessive slippage.

[Gerald]

One of the Sol 708 MARDIs in an enhanced version, to provide a look to the ground:

(and to indicate, how beautiful MARDIs can look, sometimes)

[anticitizen2]

Sol 706 NavCam during wheel inspection - watch the lengthening shadows

709 drive into the valley

looks really nice as an anaglyph

_____________________________________________________________________________
EDIT: 710 is starting to come down

Backing up from the Rear HazCams - Anaglyph version

[Gerald]

The puzzle about the slippage has been resolved by Ken Herkenhoff's recent post:

The Sol 709 drive was not as long as planned because the minimum 2 meters of progress out of 4.5 meters commanded was not achieved. This software check may be disabled for future drives across sandy material, to allow more slippage before the rover stops driving.

So the criteria in this case seems to have been the overall progress in contrast to a short-term excessive slippage.

[jvandriel]

The Navcam view on Sol 709.

Jan van Driel

[Phil Stooke]

... and a circular view of it - thanks, Jan!

Phil

[fredk]

Have we seen flatfielded images on the jpl jpeg site before?
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/multimedia/ra...mera=CHEMCAM%5F

[James Sorenson]

Those images are not flat-fielded. But I do see possible sky-flats that can be turned into rough flat-fields . Those type of images appear like all others on the raw page. You will not see of coarse calibrated images that have been flat-fielded. Those have to wait until they hit the PDS.

[fredk]

Compare these two images:


It's clear the second one is a flatfielded version of the first. The filenames differ only in the text codes (EDR vs PRC and M_ vs L1). The paths are also different.

I don't recall anything like this before. Either a glitch or a new policy (hopefully the latter!).

[James Sorenson]

Oh wow! I didn't scroll down far enough to see that! You are right, those have been flat-fielded in the enhanced section. That is interesting!

[elakdawalla]

OOOOOOOOOO!

[jvandriel]

The Navcam L panoramic view on Sol 710.

Jan van Driel

[Gerald]

... I don't recall anything like this before. Either a glitch or a new policy (hopefully the latter!).

It's RDRs -- in PNG format -- in addition to EDR JPGs, great! It makes RMI images much easier to use.

[fredk]

Is driving straight down the middle the only route?
What about tip-toeing around the edge

It looks like driving along the edges is indeed the plan acording to this release:
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/multimedia/vi...index.cfm?v=209

[fredk]

in PNG format

Yeah - there was a good argument to be made for providing flatfielded images, since this camera suffers from such severe vignetting and typically clipping near the centre in the jpl jpegs. But png is icing on the cake!

[anticitizen2]

I combined the 709-710 out and back drives

Rear Haz looking into the valley - Anaglyph

Front Haz looking out of the valley - Anaglyph

NavCam - Anaglyph

[Phil Stooke]

Jan's sol 710 pan in circular format. Thanks, Jan.

Phil

[anticitizen2]

Ok, I'm a little nervous
MAHLI of wheels in the sand

RHaz of short drive on 711 - Anaglyph

[SpaceListener]

I am surprised to see the sand marked by the wheels of the rover so dark. It looks like that the under surface is wet for the so arid zone. I am supposing that the sand under surface would be about the same colour as the surface ones.

[algorithm]

Ok, I'm a little nervous

This baby probably has more torque per (Something!) than a Bugatti Veyron, so if you can see the axle then everything is probably cool.

[fredk]

I am surprised to see the sand marked by the wheels of the rover so dark.

We've seen this before - I guess it's just that the top surface has a coating of the ubiquitous light coloured dust.

[RoverDriver]

This baby probably has more torque per (Something!) than a Bugatti Veyron, so if you can see the axle then everything is probably cool.

About 740 ft lb. About three times my car has.

Paolo

[xflare]

Impressive layering - SOL 710

Attached thumbnail(s)

 

[Astro0]

Why am I hearing the theme to Jaws again?

[anticitizen2]

Stirling has now been run over a few times

Curiosity summits Stirling - Anaglyph

Lots of large sandy walls, plenty of opportunities to spot material slides
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images/ms...525E01_DXXX.jpg

Can't wait to see the valleys post-Curiosity with HiRISE

[algorithm]

Impressive layering - SOL 710

Impressive indeed.

Attached thumbnail(s)

 

[jvandriel]

Sol 711
2 ChemCam images stitched together.

Jan van Driel

[atomoid]

the fin lurks yonder (crosseye)

[climber]

About three times my car has.
Paolo

Is this yet another new Nasa measurement unit ?

[serpens]

Foot pounds? I thought given the US membership of BIPM and the fate of the Mars Polar Orbiter the MKS system would be compulsory in all mission aspects?

[jvandriel]

The Navcam L view on Sol 711.

Jan van Driel

[RoverDriver]

Foot pounds? I thought given the US membership of BIPM and the fate of the Mars Polar Orbiter the MKS system would be compulsory in all mission aspects?

Yes, the actual specs say 1000 Nm. I converted to ft lb since most of the US readers are probably familiar with that unit.

Paolo

[anticitizen2]

Back out of the valley!

http://i.imgur.com/DmkA36H.gif


From the latest USGS post, it sounds like there has been a lot of staring at HiRISE images over the last few days

[serpens]

Is this a case of a reverse Kipling "Out of the valley of death rode the 600"?

[mcaplinger]

I thought they had done a lot of testing of driving on sand, so to be concerned about it seems odd. Is there something unusual about this particular sand?

[fredk]

it sounds like there has been a lot of staring at HiRISE images over the last few days

Maybe more likely poring over the numbers from the Hidden Valley drives and comparing with the test drives. These are the first MSL drives on substantial Martian sand, and I guess there's nothing like the "ground truth".

[anticitizen2]

Right, but the strategic planning had been through the valleys - I was guessing they didn't have a solid "next best route" over the terrain they were trying to avoid beginning at the Hidden Valley entrance.
It wasn't any serious analysis, just a comment to relieve some anxiety over the 180

I hope they show some of the shredded wheels from the Mars Yard still functioning to reassure wheel-worriers

[Explorer1]

Wasn't the plan to drive as close to the cliff edge as possible, so that there was solid ground right underneath in case of slippage? I'm sure it was mentioned in one of the earlier posts but I can't find it now...

[fredk]

Yep - check out this post. I guess it's still a question of what the ground is like near the sides - in particular, how steep is it?

[jmknapp]

solid ground right underneath in case of slippage

Though perhaps all it would take is one little divot with deeper sand the catch a wheel?

wheel-worriers

As reported over the last months, that category would include much of the mission team.

Wouldn't envy the person who signs off on the plan to go into the sand drifts though. Better the devil you know? BTW, here's the egress:

http://curiosityrover.com/tracking/drivetr...hp?drivenum=228

[elakdawalla]

I thought they had done a lot of testing of driving on sand, so to be concerned about it seems odd. Is there something unusual about this particular sand?

I did not have the impression they expected so much slip on the sand in these valleys. They crossed Dingo Gap with little problem. At the same time, it does seem to me that they were making enough progress and almost all the way through the ripples on sol 709 that it seems like they should've made it if they kept going -- but that clearly wasn't good enough.

Apparently they're still at work today as I type. Sometimes Mars is hard.

[Gerald]

... do we keep trying to drive in the sand in Hidden Valley, or do we drive on the rocky surface of Zabriskie plateau?

of Ryan Anderson's USGS post.

My guess would be, after looking at features like this funnel(?)

(Sol 710) they'll prefer taking the predictable and manageable risk of Zabriskie plateau over the fuzzy risk of the sand.

[Bubbinski]

If they have to go out of Hidden Valley, where is the point on the Zabriskie plateau where the "caprock" ends? And are they going to still try to reach that nearby outcrop they think is Mt. Sharp material? (Pahrump Hills as mentioned a couple of pages back)

[marsophile]

Is there a third alternative? Perhaps the dark sands of the "moat" (if I may call it that) below Mount Sharp might be more stable than the light sands in Hidden Valley?

[fredk]

I've wondered about the dark sands too. Looking at the orbital imagery, there actually looks like a finger of the dark sands reaching into a southern fork of Hidden Valley, only a couple hundred metres to our south. But the problem with that might be that if the dark sands are found to be not traversable, then you may have to do substantial backtracking to avoid them.

Isn't back seat driving so much fun?

[Gerald]

If they have to go out of Hidden Valley, where is the point on the Zabriskie plateau where the "caprock" ends? And are they going to still try to reach that nearby outcrop they think is Mt. Sharp material? (Pahrump Hills as mentioned a couple of pages back)

Based on a screenshot of Joe's site (basing on HiRISE/SPICE in this screenshot), here a version enhancing (radius 2) hipass features as red:

Hipass features should correlate to surface roughness, although using a DTM would be more appropriate.
I wouldn't rule out, that there may exist routes avoiding the Hidden Valley, but still reaching to the nearby outcrop. I've marked the beginning of two such out-of-the-hip route candidates, both not free of risk.

[Bubbinski]

Thanks Gerald! That green route looks like it passes too close to the valley edge for comfort (having a nightmare vision of a tumbling rover).

[CosmicRocker]

I just wanted to make everyone aware of the fact that next week (Aug. 14 & 15) there will be a Von Karman Lecture about Curiosity's second year on Mars. It bears the intriguing title "Curiosity's Second Year: The Epic and Occasionally Bogus Journey to the Foothills of Mt. Sharp."

The lecture will be in Pasadena, CA, but it looks like it will also be webcasted on Ustream.

[Bubbinski]

Just took a look at sol 714 raw images. Looks like they're on the plateau and away from Hidden Valley entirely.

[ngunn]

It seems there are many different types of sand drift on Mars. Some are solid enough you could just about cut steps with your boots while on others you're immediately up to your thighs. I wonder if it has to do with how long they've been immobile (I mean the dark sand, not the rusty dust on top)?

[fredk]

Looks like they're on the plateau and away from Hidden Valley entirely.

Yeah, and I can't imagine why we'd drive this far out of HV if the valley route was still considered an option:

[jvandriel]

The Navcam view on Sol 713.

Jan van Driel

[James Sorenson]

An apparent radiation storm? A whole sequence of Rear Hazcam images with salt and pepper noise. Sol-710
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images/pr...RHAZ00233M_.JPG

[fredk]

It looks to me like the extra noise you see when longer exposures are taken. But this sequence was just after 3pm local time, when you shouldn't need long exposures.

[nprev]

Lossy uplink due to a poor look angle? They've begin moving orbiters around in preparation for the comet encounter, I believe.

Could be a few things, though.

[Phil Stooke]

Here is a circular view of sol 714's location. Looks like we may drive across that outcrop and into "Neil Armstrong's footpint" as it was described earlier.

Phil

[anticitizen2]

Anaglyph of the tracks in the valley - Cross-eyed

Sol 714 anaglyph album looking across the valley and at the 'bootprint' - Stretched

[fredk]

The noise in rhaz can't be cosmic rays or lossy uplink, because the bright pixels are at the same position sols apart - compare, eg, these frames:
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images/pr...RHAZ00233M_.JPG
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl-raw-images/pr...RHAZ00311M_.JPG
My guess is, given the location of rhaz, radiation damage to the CCD from the RTG. It's been gradually getting worse, but is more noticable with longer exposures.

Given the fixed nature of the damage, it should be easy to code a filter to remove the hot pixels quite effectively.

[algorithm]

My first attempt at making a HDR version of an image.

The original NavCam image from sol 713



and the 'HDR' version.




I chose this image at random so it may produce better results on others, I do think it has definitely brought out some 'hidden' details in certain areas though.

[elakdawalla]

I encourage people interested in this kind of processing to return to the PDS versions of images once they become available, because the data in the PDS have much higher bit depth to begin with.

[jvandriel]

The Navcam panoramic view on Sol 714.

Jan van Driel

[algorithm]

I thought I would try the same thing on a colour image.

Original pan




HDR version




It seemed to work better in some areas than others.
I think I'll practice a bit more.

[fredk]

What exactly do you mean by "HDR"? Normally HDR means combining different exposures (or perhaps starting with higher than 8 bpp bitdepth). But for these images we only have single 8 bpp frames available so far. Maybe you're just doing a levels/gamma adjustment?

[algorithm]

What exactly do you mean by "HDR"? Normally HDR means combining different exposures (or perhaps starting with higher than 8 bpp bitdepth). But for these images we only have single 8 bpp frames available so far. Maybe you're just doing a levels/gamma adjustment?

Adjust the exposure settings up and down by equal ammounts(stops) saving each as a separate file then recombining as a single enhanced HDR image.

[djellison]

Why bother going thru that process? Just load the single image into, say, Photomatix and work with it there. You're just tone-mapping an 8-bit image - there's nothing to be gained from trying to fake different exposures.

[mcaplinger]

A whole sequence of Rear Hazcam images with salt and pepper noise.

Technically this isn't salt and pepper noise because there are no dark pixels, only bright ones. (No pepper, only salt.) So these are unlikely to be transmission errors (they couldn't be anyway because image compression causes transmission errors to look completely different) but hot pixels. Hot pixels are worse with longer exposure and with higher camera head temperature.
As noted the rear hazcams are closer to the RTG and also to the other neutron source on the rover, DAN.

[algorithm]

Why bother going thru that process? Just load the single image into, say, Photomatix and work with it there. You're just tone-mapping an 8-bit image - there's nothing to be gained from trying to fake different exposures.

Fortunately I don't have a clue what you are talking about.

Seems like my HDR days are over though.

[djellison]

Not questioning the results - just wondering what your pipeline is that requires making faked +/-ev pictures first.

[atomoid]

yes i do like the nice HDR-ish contrast enhancements resulting from algorithm's approach, its hard to say whether or not photoshop level adjustments on a single image wouldn't be capable of producing identical results.

Nice dry mass-wasting example on SOL712, this 'micro-RSL' most reminiscent of the large-scale variety popularly misconceived as brine flows..

[scalbers]

I thought HDR (high dynamic range) would generally reduce the contrast of the features from multiple images to fit the brightness range of a single image. Or as I gather from the above, some type of contrast adjustment or hi-pass filtering (i.e. tone mapping), done as pseudo-HDR on a single original image? I can follow the point that the post-processing normally done with merged images might still enhance the equivalent of a single image.

[djellison]

There are two HDR techniques. One is simply exposure fusion - compressing multiple exposures to capture detail in both highlight and shadow regions of photographs.

The other is tone mapping- this, at some given radius, adjusts the brightness/contrast/gamma etc of the image area by area such that everywhere can express more detail (i.e. brighten areas in shadow to see detail there, darken areas like skies to see detail in clouds)

I dabble in landscape photography and I'm pretty fond of what the latter, done with a little subtlety, can do.

http://dougellison.smugmug.com/Landscapes/...int/i-3hKxSfc/A

[brellis]

It has been a little over one earth year since MSL departed from Glenelg, traveling about (edit: 7km) "as the rover drives" across the plains to her current location.

From the July 2013 article:

NASA chose Gale Crater as the landing site specifically to dispatch Curiosity to investigate the sedimentary layers of Mount Sharp because in surveys from Mars orbit it exhibited signatures of clay minerals that form in neutral water and that could possibly support the origin and evolution of simple Martian life forms, past or present.

Mount Sharp lies about 5 miles (8 kilometers) distant – as the Martian crow flies.

And Curiosity must also pass through a potentially treacherous dune field to get there.

I'm happy to leave it to more qualified UMSFers to estimate the current distance to Mt. Sharp "as the crow flies".

btw, big thanks to nogal for providing the wonderful Google Mars MSL Route map!

For those of us (like me) who always have it in the back of our minds how cool it'd be to see how high and far MSL can climb up Mt. Sharp - MSL's driving distance is encouraging news. Big congrats to the drivers! Given that the power supply has a good decade of life left, there's plenty of time to dilly-dally around with all that science stuff in the process though I must confess to having a great deal of Curiosity about the terrain MSL will be crossing in the ongoing journey to Mt Sharp! (p.s. - I still like Aeolis Mons)

[lyford]

Friends -

De-lurking after many moons to just ask if anyone has commented on the darker streaks we have seen such as these on sol 712? I scrolled through some past posts but I may have missed it. I know it may just be a slump or darker sand being funneled down but it sure reminds me of some other Martian imagery with darker streaks down crater or canyon walls....

Anyway, back to the being quiet and contributing to the healthy s/n ratio.

Lyford