"Dragonfly" Titan explorer drone, NASA funds Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory (APL) |
"Dragonfly" Titan explorer drone, NASA funds Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory (APL) |
Dec 20 2017, 09:04 PM
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#1
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Junior Member Group: Members Posts: 66 Joined: 3-August 12 Member No.: 6454 |
Is there a specific website for this Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory (APL) concept for a Titan explorer drone?
Looks to be an RTG powered machine, somewhat reminiscent of MSL Curiosity (RTG sticking out the tail end). But no camera mast, ChemCam, or sampling arm visible in the concept illustration. QUOTE Dec. 20, 2017 RELEASE 17-101 NASA Invests in Concept Development for Missions to Comet, Saturn Moon Titan Dragonfly Dragonfly is a drone-like rotorcraft that would explore the prebiotic chemistry and habitability of dozens of sites on Saturn’s moon Titan, an ocean world in our solar system. Elizabeth Turtle from the Johns Hopkins University Applied Physics Laboratory (APL) in Laurel, Maryland, is the lead investigator, with APL providing project management. https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-inv...turn-moon-titan |
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Dec 20 2017, 09:33 PM
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Administrator Group: Admin Posts: 5172 Joined: 4-August 05 From: Pasadena, CA, USA, Earth Member No.: 454 |
-------------------- My website - My Patreon - @elakdawalla on Twitter - Please support unmannedspaceflight.com by donating here.
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Dec 22 2017, 01:22 AM
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 613 Joined: 23-February 07 From: Occasionally in Columbia, MD Member No.: 1764 |
Note especially the quite detailed article that went online there this morning.(jump/scroll to resources) |
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Dec 22 2017, 03:55 PM
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 363 Joined: 13-April 06 From: Malta Member No.: 741 |
This mission should easily top the list. Titan here we come!
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Dec 29 2017, 10:45 PM
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#5
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Junior Member Group: Members Posts: 40 Joined: 28-July 07 Member No.: 2984 |
I use Titan as a case study for an aero class I teach, and am super-psyched at the idea of such a probe. Low gravity and high density are a rotorcraft's best friends.
Already drooling over the detailed 3D photogrammetry extracted from aerial images. |
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Dec 30 2017, 05:39 AM
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 718 Joined: 22-April 05 Member No.: 351 |
This mission should easily top the list. Titan here we come! The science for a comet sample return is very compelling (as is the science for Dragonfly; it comes down to do you prefer a great apple or a great banana?). And I'd never bet on an easy competition with any proposal lead by Squyres, and he's devoted much of his time the last three years putting his comet sample return proposal together. -------------------- |
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Dec 30 2017, 12:23 PM
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 363 Joined: 13-April 06 From: Malta Member No.: 741 |
The science for a comet sample return is very compelling (as is the science for Dragonfly; it comes down to do you prefer a great apple or a great banana?). . No disrespect to Squyres, but I can already imagine drone flying over titan lakes and magic Island plus extra miles of vistas to image and investigate. This is too good to let go and yes to me is definitely more compelling than the comet sampling mission. And I'd never bet on an easy competition with any proposal lead by Squyres, and he's devoted much of his time the last three years putting his comet sample return proposal together. |
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Dec 30 2017, 04:52 PM
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#8
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 2547 Joined: 13-September 05 Member No.: 497 |
I share everyone's excitement, but we are unlikely to get a lot more public information about either of these missions before the downselect, and the decision isn't made based on popularity. You can go back historically and look at which missions were competing and which were selected, but even if there are clear patterns there, that's not a great indication of future decisions.
-------------------- Disclaimer: This post is based on public information only. Any opinions are my own.
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Dec 30 2017, 05:30 PM
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#9
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Junior Member Group: Members Posts: 66 Joined: 3-August 12 Member No.: 6454 |
I can already imagine drone flying over titan lakes and magic Island plus extra miles of vistas to image and investigate. From the description of Dragonfly in http://dragonfly.jhuapl.edu/docs/DragonflyTechDigestAPL.pdf it would not be able to go anywhere near the polar lakes region, landing instead in the equatorial dune fields. QUOTE Although the exploration of Titan’s seas had previously been considered, notably by the APL-led Titan Mare Explorer (TiME) Discovery concept, the timing mandated by the announcement of opportunity precluded such a mission. Specifically, with launch specified prior to the end of 2025, Titan arrival would be in the mid-2030s, during northern winter. This means the seas, near Titan’s north pole, are in darkness and direct-to-Earth (DTE) communication is impossible. Like TIME, Dragonfly also proposes direct-to-Earth (DTE) communication. Maybe a south-polar visit might be feasible ? ....Ontario Lacus ?? |
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Dec 30 2017, 06:03 PM
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#10
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 2547 Joined: 13-September 05 Member No.: 497 |
Maybe a south-polar visit might be feasible ? ....Ontario Lacus ?? From the article: QUOTE Arrival at Titan in the mid-2030s with DTE communication suggests a low-latitude landing site. This requirement means a similar location and season to the Huygens descent in 2005, so the wind profile and turbulence characteristics measured by the Huygens probe are directly relevant. Furthermore, the sand seas that girdle Titan’s equator are both scientifically attractive and favorable in terms of terrain characteristics for landing safety—indeed, it was for these reasons that the 2007 Flagship Study identified these dune fields as the preferred initial target landing area. And it's unlikely that the vehicle will have enough range to fly from equator to pole. -------------------- Disclaimer: This post is based on public information only. Any opinions are my own.
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Dec 31 2017, 02:12 AM
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 718 Joined: 22-April 05 Member No.: 351 |
And it's unlikely that the vehicle will have enough range to fly from equator to pole. I'm not so sure. Assume that Dragonfly lands exactly at the equator. The north pole (and the lake region begins before this) is 4044 km away. Assume that Dragonfly has had a great prime mission and the team is willing to just push it to go the distance. At 40 km per hop once every Titan day (~16 Earth days), the north pole is 4.4 years away. Given that Titan is pretty benign, once you've solved the problem of how to stay warm (always take your warm MMRTG with you when you visit), the limiting factor on the mission may well be how long the the MMRTG power lasts given radioactive decay. This map in this conference abstract suggests targets that might be in the range of a primary or a first extended mission. LPSC 2017 abstract -------------------- |
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Dec 31 2017, 02:55 AM
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#12
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 2113 Joined: 13-February 10 From: Ontario Member No.: 5221 |
Opportunity certainly went beyond its designed range, I wouldn't be surprised that a flying vehicle could go so much farther.
I would be more worried that perhaps the environment isn't so benign; Oppy dealt with dust storms, but what about possible flash floods (as the Huygens landing site showed)? Without weather observations from orbit, that would be a nasty surprise outside the equatorial dune seas! Or the rotors' reaction to giant raindrops in-flight.... |
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Dec 31 2017, 09:31 AM
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#13
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Merciless Robot Group: Admin Posts: 8789 Joined: 8-December 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 602 |
I wonder how effectively it could navigate over long distances. We don't have nearly good enough surface maps for AI terrain recognition, there's no significant magnetic field, so all that's left is inertial. Maintaining a good heading alignment over long periods may be problematic since IMUs do have inherent drift, and though periodic realignment is the usual method to correct that Titan's outer shell rotation seems to vary significantly in comparison to the rest of the moon's mass (not sure if that's a fixed offset or variable), and measuring rate & direction of rotation after vertical alignment is the usual method of finding true north (and latitude).
This could possibly be augmented by RDFing the vehicle's downlink to Earth, but not sure how much position precision could be achieved...tens/hundreds of km? Then again, maybe the position of the Sun could be used as well, foggy though it's gonna be. Dunno if Saturn would be detectable, but the Sun's definitely gonna be the only possible reference star. -------------------- A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
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Dec 31 2017, 02:36 PM
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#14
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Member Group: Members Posts: 684 Joined: 24-July 15 Member No.: 7619 |
We don't have nearly good enough surface maps for AI terrain recognition, there's no significant magnetic field, so all that's left is inertial. Not necessarily, just old-school triangulation: "1800s mountain peak GPS", using trigonometry to track where the mountain peaks are on the horizon. Ala "the Englishman who went up a hill, but came down a mountain" you build up a triangular grid of the highest points by surveying. That lets you triangulate your map location, and calculate your height, based where they are on the horizon. |
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Dec 31 2017, 04:25 PM
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#15
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Member Group: Admin Posts: 978 Joined: 29-September 06 From: Pasadena, CA - USA Member No.: 1200 |
... but the Sun's definitely gonna be the only possible reference star. The nadir vector can be detected by the accelerometers. The Mars rovers we use: clock, Sun position, and nadir vector. As an alternative gyro compassing might be quite more difficult but not impossible. Paolo -------------------- Disclaimer: all opinions, ideas and information included here are my own,and should not be intended to represent opinion or policy of my employer.
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