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InSight Cruise Phase, Events during Mars transit prior to EDL
nprev
post May 8 2018, 05:35 AM
Post #1


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Hey again, everyone. This thread will be for discussion of anything that happens between now & landing day, currently 26 Nov US Pacific time (UTC-8 hrs during that part of the year).


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Guest_mcmcmc_*
post Nov 22 2018, 09:15 PM
Post #2





Guests






Added manometers for deceleration and attack angle.
http://win98.altervista.org/space/explorat...-simulator.html

It's cool to see even parachute oscillations and legs deployment in the "amplified" accelerometer! (first gauge)
Paper says attack angle is unreliable after chute deployment, I don't know why.
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Guest_mcmcmc_*
post Nov 23 2018, 09:44 AM
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QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 22 2018, 10:15 PM) *
Paper says attack angle is unreliable after chute deployment, I don't know why.

from official papers it results that even NASA does not why attack angle data are totally unreliable after parachute deployment, but i can't find any further update after 2010.

There are 3 different issues on attack angle reconstruction:
1) discrepancies between predicted and re-constructed angles of attack addressed by Desai et al.(2008).
2) discrepancies (+/- 2° , which could be "explained" by a 300 m/s wind) between results from direct reconstruction from gyros and indirect reconstruction from accelerometers - "Results from the Phoenix Atmospheric Structure Experiment" Paul Withers and David Catling - 2010
3) nonsense values of angle attack at parachute deployment (46°) and after (up to 132°) - "Production of Reduced Data Records for the Phoenix Atmospheric Structure Experiment" - Paul Withers, D. C. Catlingb -

From data it also appears that Phoenix touched ground... 1.2 km above ground ("Results from the Phoenix Atmospheric Structure Experiment" Paul Withers and David Catling - 2010). I'm not sure if they are talking about "above MOLA level" or "above ground level".


MSL EDL data just stop at 12 km above surface.
I've yet to examine EDL data for MPF, MER, and Schiaparelli, anyway last part of EDLs looks quite "mysterious" yet. Still a lot of work to do till safe manned capsule landing on Mars!

Now I am very curious about what Insight EDL data will show.

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I also found another interesting paper about an unexpected issue on Phoenix mission: descent radar locking on jettisoned heatshield and thus providing false values for altitude!
"Phoenix Landing Radar Heatshield Anomaly" - J. Eric Belz, Curtis Chen, and Ben Cichy

Together with high possibility of Phoenix cruise stage recontact with Phoenix lander during EDL, it's an issue I was totally unaware of till a week ago.


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Posts in this topic
- nprev   InSight Cruise Phase   May 8 2018, 05:35 AM
- - propguy   TCM1 was completed 5/22 (yeah!). Press rele...   May 24 2018, 07:00 PM
|- - MahFL   QUOTE (propguy @ May 24 2018, 08:00 PM) T...   May 25 2018, 12:53 AM
- - nprev   Music to our ears, Propguy; thank you!!...   May 25 2018, 12:42 AM
- - Explorer1   The cubesats have done their TCMs as well ( https:...   Jun 2 2018, 12:23 AM
- - PaulH51   InSight's Inner Sanctum Revealed (PIA22647): T...   Aug 21 2018, 01:13 AM
- - Phil Stooke   Do we know anything yet about the image release po...   Oct 24 2018, 02:00 AM
|- - MahFL   Any news on Insight being updated on Eyes, so we c...   Oct 26 2018, 12:09 AM
||- - djellison   QUOTE (MahFL @ Oct 25 2018, 04:09 PM) Any...   Oct 28 2018, 03:02 PM
||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (MahFL @ Oct 26 2018, 01:09 AM) Any...   Oct 29 2018, 02:49 PM
|- - Hungry4info   QUOTE (Phil Stooke @ Oct 23 2018, 08:00 P...   Oct 26 2018, 01:10 AM
- - Explorer1   InSight press conference on now, everything with t...   Oct 31 2018, 06:07 PM
- - mcmcmc   Insight will have same EDL profile of Phoenix, so ...   Nov 7 2018, 07:07 PM
|- - propguy   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 7 2018, 01:07 PM) Not...   Nov 9 2018, 09:11 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (propguy @ Nov 9 2018, 10:11 PM) so...   Nov 13 2018, 01:16 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 13 2018, 05:16 AM) Do...   Nov 13 2018, 03:22 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 13 2018, 04:22 PM...   Nov 13 2018, 03:40 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 13 2018, 07:40 AM) .....   Nov 13 2018, 04:03 PM
|- - propguy   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 13 2018, 08:40 AM) He...   Nov 13 2018, 04:22 PM
- - mcmcmc   Not exactly "realtime telemetries", but ...   Nov 14 2018, 05:42 PM
- - mcmcmc   Any chance that data used to plot charts in this d...   Nov 16 2018, 01:24 PM
- - mcmcmc   Well I eventually found something. They're onl...   Nov 16 2018, 02:42 PM
- - mcaplinger   There are SPICE predict files at https://naif.jpl....   Nov 16 2018, 04:09 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 16 2018, 05:09 PM...   Nov 17 2018, 09:59 AM
- - mcmcmc   Damn... How do I calculate/find SpeedX, SpeedY and...   Nov 17 2018, 10:37 AM
- - mcaplinger   Presumably you are still seeing the rotation rate ...   Nov 17 2018, 10:34 PM
- - mcaplinger   Attached is a text file with 1-minute sampling fro...   Nov 18 2018, 12:24 AM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 18 2018, 01:24 AM...   Nov 18 2018, 07:36 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 18 2018, 11:36 AM) To...   Nov 18 2018, 08:06 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 18 2018, 09:06 PM...   Nov 18 2018, 09:52 PM
||- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 18 2018, 01:52 PM) yo...   Nov 18 2018, 10:55 PM
||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 18 2018, 11:55 PM...   Nov 19 2018, 10:25 AM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 18 2018, 09:06 PM...   Nov 19 2018, 03:21 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 19 2018, 07:21 AM) An...   Nov 19 2018, 03:48 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 19 2018, 04:48 PM...   Nov 19 2018, 09:17 PM
||- - propguy   Latest status. We did TCM5 yesterday (could not m...   Nov 20 2018, 12:38 AM
||- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (propguy @ Nov 19 2018, 04:38 PM) A...   Nov 20 2018, 04:16 AM
||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (propguy @ Nov 20 2018, 01:38 AM) L...   Nov 20 2018, 10:02 AM
|||- - propguy   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 20 2018, 03:02 AM) Go...   Nov 20 2018, 07:53 PM
|||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (propguy @ Nov 20 2018, 08:53 PM) F...   Nov 20 2018, 10:07 PM
|||- - djellison   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 20 2018, 02:07 PM) I ...   Nov 20 2018, 10:41 PM
|||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2018, 11:41 PM)...   Nov 21 2018, 12:45 PM
||- - ElkGroveDan   QUOTE (propguy @ Nov 19 2018, 04:38 PM) O...   Nov 21 2018, 04:41 AM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 19 2018, 04:48 PM...   Nov 20 2018, 10:08 AM
- - nprev   Thanks for the insight (rimshot!) as always, P...   Nov 20 2018, 02:39 AM
- - RoverDriver   Going Down, Jeff Beck "Well I'm going do...   Nov 20 2018, 07:08 AM
- - akuo   The Rasmus - F-F-F-Falling "I need a flame, ...   Nov 20 2018, 07:55 AM
- - mcmcmc   Found another interesting page, which makes more s...   Nov 20 2018, 02:18 PM
- - PaulH51   Does anyone know what happens to MarCO-A & Mar...   Nov 21 2018, 03:32 AM
|- - Paolo   QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Nov 21 2018, 04:32 AM) O...   Nov 21 2018, 05:54 AM
|- - MahFL   QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Nov 21 2018, 03:32 AM) D...   Nov 21 2018, 10:48 AM
||- - PaulH51   QUOTE (MahFL @ Nov 21 2018, 06:48 PM) The...   Nov 21 2018, 11:11 AM
||- - Explorer1   QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Nov 21 2018, 06:11 AM) F...   Nov 21 2018, 02:28 PM
||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Nov 21 2018, 12:11 PM) F...   Nov 21 2018, 02:48 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Nov 20 2018, 07:32 PM) D...   Nov 21 2018, 04:27 PM
|- - PaulH51   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 22 2018, 12:27 AM)...   Nov 21 2018, 11:47 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Nov 21 2018, 03:47 PM) F...   Nov 22 2018, 01:49 AM
|- - PaulH51   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 22 2018, 09:49 AM)...   Nov 22 2018, 03:19 AM
|- - ElkGroveDan   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 21 2018, 05:49 PM)...   Nov 22 2018, 05:43 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 22 2018, 02:49 AM)...   Nov 22 2018, 05:55 PM
- - dmuller   Hello again ... those who have been here a decade ...   Nov 21 2018, 11:05 AM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (dmuller @ Nov 21 2018, 12:05 PM) m...   Nov 21 2018, 12:57 PM
- - mcmcmc   Can anybody help? I found this description: QUOTE ...   Nov 21 2018, 02:46 PM
|- - Gerald   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 21 2018, 03:46 PM) .....   Nov 21 2018, 05:18 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (Gerald @ Nov 21 2018, 06:18 PM) Ma...   Nov 22 2018, 07:59 AM
- - Explorer1   Yes, 3 minutes before touchdown an image will be a...   Nov 21 2018, 03:50 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (Explorer1 @ Nov 21 2018, 04:50 PM)...   Nov 21 2018, 04:43 PM
- - mcmcmc   These links provide raw numerical data for MARCO-A...   Nov 22 2018, 01:43 PM
- - nprev   Forum note: The EDL thread will go live at 0800 PS...   Nov 22 2018, 08:09 PM
- - mcmcmc   Added manometers for deceleration and attack angle...   Nov 22 2018, 09:15 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 22 2018, 10:15 PM) Pa...   Nov 23 2018, 09:44 AM
- - mcmcmc   Just to better know what Insight is about to face:...   Nov 23 2018, 02:08 PM
- - nogal   For the Google Mars community, here is a KMZ file ...   Nov 23 2018, 04:09 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (nogal @ Nov 23 2018, 05:09 PM) For...   Nov 23 2018, 06:58 PM
|- - nogal   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 23 2018, 06:58 PM) Da...   Nov 24 2018, 02:23 AM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (nogal @ Nov 24 2018, 03:23 AM) Her...   Nov 24 2018, 12:04 PM
||- - djellison   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 24 2018, 04:04 AM) wo...   Nov 24 2018, 03:33 PM
|||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 24 2018, 04:33 PM)...   Nov 24 2018, 03:43 PM
||- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 24 2018, 04:04 AM) Th...   Nov 24 2018, 03:34 PM
||- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Nov 24 2018, 04:34 PM...   Nov 24 2018, 03:53 PM
||- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 24 2018, 07:53 AM) Ho...   Nov 24 2018, 04:41 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (nogal @ Nov 24 2018, 03:23 AM) Her...   Nov 24 2018, 07:14 PM
|- - nogal   [Unfortunately I can no more work on it till 2018-...   Nov 24 2018, 11:37 PM
- - nprev   I believe that angle of attack information after c...   Nov 23 2018, 08:20 PM
|- - mcmcmc   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 23 2018, 09:20 PM) I b...   Nov 23 2018, 08:37 PM
- - djellison   It doesn't actually matter. The s/c will be s...   Nov 23 2018, 10:02 PM
- - nprev   Another way to put it: The angle of attack of the ...   Nov 24 2018, 01:15 AM
- - mcmcmc   NASA horizons data about Insight usually stopped a...   Nov 24 2018, 12:29 PM
- - mcmcmc   Declared sources for Horizons data: CODETrajector...   Nov 24 2018, 12:34 PM
|- - dmuller   QUOTE (mcmcmc @ Nov 24 2018, 11:34 PM) De...   Nov 25 2018, 03:56 AM
- - mcmcmc   Simulator is eventually finished: I cleaned it up,...   Nov 24 2018, 03:30 PM
- - mcaplinger   The way EDL is validated is that many Monte Carlo ...   Nov 24 2018, 04:25 PM
- - mcmcmc   To "touch with your hand" Insight, or at...   Nov 24 2018, 05:43 PM
- - nprev   Here's a useful timeline of EDL and post-landi...   Nov 25 2018, 01:02 AM
- - Phil Stooke   https://mars.nasa.gov/insight/multimedia/raw-image...   Nov 25 2018, 04:34 AM
|- - MahFL   Is the last TCM going to be used ?   Nov 25 2018, 06:09 AM
- - nogal   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 25 2018, 01:02 AM) I d...   Nov 25 2018, 02:15 PM
- - nprev   Bit late, but press briefing live now. Appears tha...   Nov 25 2018, 06:10 PM
- - nogal   Here is a new version of the EDL simulation. Just...   Nov 25 2018, 09:40 PM
- - nprev   <shrug> I could be wrong too about the direc...   Nov 25 2018, 10:25 PM
- - MahFL   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 25 2018, 10:25 PM) ...   Nov 25 2018, 10:35 PM
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