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Voyager Status, What is it?
tuvas
post Dec 6 2006, 05:48 AM
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Anyone know the latest Voyager status? I've hear rumors, but I'm wondering if anyone has anything more concrete (I won't share the rumors, as I really don't know much about it, so...)
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mcaplinger
post Feb 9 2024, 02:45 AM
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The Voyager FDS was designed several years before the first microprocessors. It has some unusual architectural features, including 128 general-purpose registers (mapped from the main RAM and not as separate logic entities) and a six-clock basic instruction cycle operating on 4-bit values per clock.

I'm not sure how the Voyager team is proceeding. If I were faced with this problem, I would try to build the smallest possible software load that would send useful telemetry to the transmitter. And to support that, I would build a software simulator of the system and make sure the behavior of existing loads was understood. The FDS memory (8K, I think) is loaded through the CCS, so it should be possible to experiment a bit with new FDS loads without the possibility of bricking everything, assuming of course that the CCS keeps working.


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Disclaimer: This post is based on public information only. Any opinions are my own.
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stevesliva
post Feb 9 2024, 06:39 AM
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What I gathered from Ars was simply that they're going to try to command it into "encounter mode" or some such other modes. Which make sense, try that before software reload, see what happens.

Floyd -- the very long PDF linked by mcaplinger above has lots of details, including that tidbit about the massive amount of registers. The images basically look like the "8K" memory is probably something like 256 discrete CMOS ICs -- making each 32 bits, so if each register is 4bits, maybe there are 16 chips for the "registers" and 240 for the rest of the memory. All that to say -- the reason the registers are mapped from "main" memory is because the MPU itself is a collection of discrete ICs on a huge board with probably hundreds of SRAM ICs... the memory bottlenecks aren't analogous to CPUs.

In any event, if there really were 128 x 4 = 512 bits of registers over 16 separate chips, simple programs probably don't need to use all 128. So I was thinking a bad register would be hypothetically easy to work around, esp since there's not image processing happening. There is some text on page 187 of the PDF about how DMA instructions take the same time that all other instructions take... or I don't quite follow. Probably the biggest distinction between the regs and the other memory words was that the regs were addressable with 7 bits of a 16-bit instruction, while the memory addresses were 4k/16=8bits? So separate instructions were needed to access the "lower 4k" instruction memory vs. upper 4k scratch vs. upper 4k scratch in other unit? Also not clear to me how a 16-bit memory word would load into 4-bit registers, but this is a special ISA, so perhaps 4 registers load at a time. The other thing indicated is that arithmetic would be slow... a several cycle operation because it was doing 4-bits a cycle. Perhaps a more common operation was to simply forward along specific ranges of data, or MSBs, etc.

All that to say, a bit flip in one of the registers shouldn't be more fatal than a bit flip in instruction memory... just even harder to work around at this stage, because you have to change and reload the firmware. And sure, if a 16-bit word has to load into 4 registers, maybe there are effectively 32 and not 128 registers, when it comes to programs loading from memory. But 32 --> 31 should still be manageable.
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mcaplinger
post Feb 9 2024, 04:09 PM
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QUOTE (stevesliva @ Feb 8 2024, 10:39 PM) *
if each register is 4bits

I don't think the registers are 4 bits, I think the ALU does arithmetic 4 bits at a time on presumably 16-bit registers. This is called bit-slicing and was a fairly common design technique at the time: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit_slicing


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Posts in this topic
- tuvas   Voyager Status   Dec 6 2006, 05:48 AM
- - PhilCo126   Indeed, both voyagers will overtake the Pioneer 10...   Feb 14 2007, 08:31 PM
- - remcook   ehm...I thought they already did??   Feb 14 2007, 09:08 PM
- - Analyst   Voyager 1 already did in 1998, Voyager 2 will in a...   Feb 15 2007, 01:16 PM
- - Analyst   The tracking schedules on the Voyager homepage fro...   Mar 5 2007, 08:12 PM
- - PhilHorzempa   Has anyone tried to determine if Voyager 1 or 2 wi...   Mar 9 2007, 07:51 PM
- - djellison   The scan platforms have been switched off for many...   Mar 9 2007, 08:09 PM
- - Analyst   Aren't the majority of the Kuiper belt objects...   Mar 9 2007, 08:30 PM
- - edstrick   Not only have the scan platform instruments been s...   Mar 10 2007, 09:50 AM
- - Gsnorgathon   Eris's orbit is indeed inclined nearly 45 degr...   Mar 11 2007, 12:40 AM
- - Analyst   QUOTE Voyager Mission Operations Status Report # 2...   Mar 11 2007, 08:58 AM
- - John Flushing   http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/daily/local/43056.php...   Mar 22 2007, 09:48 PM
- - brellis   Regarding KBO's, which were undiscovered prior...   Apr 30 2007, 06:17 AM
|- - Paolo   QUOTE (brellis @ Apr 30 2007, 08:17 AM) R...   Apr 30 2007, 08:41 AM
|- - AndyG   QUOTE (Paolo @ Apr 30 2007, 09:41 AM) The...   May 1 2007, 10:09 AM
- - Dominik   May be, it's a little bit off topic but would ...   Apr 30 2007, 11:42 PM
|- - Paolo   QUOTE (Dominik @ May 1 2007, 01:42 AM) Ma...   May 1 2007, 06:58 AM
- - brellis   My earlier question pertained to whether any of Vo...   May 1 2007, 12:50 AM
- - tasp   I am aware of the futility of examining 'do ov...   May 1 2007, 04:42 AM
- - Pando   During my recent explorations into the bowels of N...   Jun 14 2007, 05:17 AM
|- - Analyst   QUOTE (Pando @ Jun 14 2007, 05:17 AM) Sin...   Jun 14 2007, 06:25 PM
- - dilo   Thanks for the info, Pando. Let's hope magneto...   Jun 14 2007, 06:21 AM
- - monitorlizard   This is old news from the January 18, 2007, JURAP ...   Jun 14 2007, 06:53 PM
- - dilo   I tried to plot the measured magnetic field compon...   Jun 14 2007, 07:58 PM
- - Guido   Voyager reports for weeks 03-16-2007 to 07-06-2007...   Aug 11 2007, 08:28 AM
|- - jasedm   QUOTE (Guido @ Aug 11 2007, 08:28 AM) Voy...   Nov 22 2007, 08:59 AM
|- - brellis   QUOTE (jasedm @ Nov 22 2007, 01:59 AM) I...   Nov 22 2007, 11:13 AM
- - abalone   Fantastic birthday.The Voyagers will outlive them ...   Aug 21 2007, 12:47 PM
- - djellison   "needed less propellant" For what? V1 ...   Nov 22 2007, 11:52 AM
|- - ugordan   Or maybe one of the spacecraft is inherently more ...   Nov 22 2007, 12:24 PM
|- - brellis   "needed less propellant - for what?" Th...   Nov 22 2007, 12:32 PM
- - ngunn   V1 had no 'next destination' after Saturn ...   Nov 22 2007, 12:49 PM
- - jasedm   Thinking about it, perhaps the answer is a combina...   Nov 22 2007, 01:00 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (jasedm @ Nov 22 2007, 02:00 PM) 1)...   Nov 22 2007, 01:07 PM
|- - jasedm   QUOTE (ugordan @ Nov 22 2007, 01:07 PM) R...   Nov 22 2007, 01:41 PM
- - djellison   What I was suggesting is that perhaps V1's tr...   Nov 22 2007, 02:03 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 22 2007, 03:03 PM)...   Nov 22 2007, 02:07 PM
- - Bernard1963   I was wondering if anyone else had noticed / had a...   Jun 20 2019, 09:06 AM
|- - Xcalibrator   QUOTE (Bernard1963 @ Jun 20 2019, 04:06 A...   Jul 6 2019, 02:35 PM
- - stevesliva   A month ago, Voyager 2 notes this sort of activity...   Jun 20 2019, 12:51 PM
- - Bernard1963   Thank you stevesliva. Even though I've only ju...   Jul 5 2019, 08:51 PM
- - Bernard1963   On the subject of Voyager 2 I notice from https://...   Jul 5 2019, 08:56 PM
- - Bernard1963   They've fixed it pretty quickly once they admi...   Jul 9 2019, 10:38 AM
- - stevesliva   Coincidentally posted yesterday: https://voyager.j...   Jul 9 2019, 01:24 PM
|- - JRehling   I don't nitpick often (do I?) but while the Vo...   Jul 10 2019, 05:08 AM
- - Bernard1963   I've noticed the past couple of days Voyager 1...   Aug 17 2019, 12:24 AM
- - Bernard1963   I should have noted that around the 7th September ...   Sep 24 2019, 11:25 AM
- - Bernard1963   With info taken from one of the controllers at Can...   Jan 28 2020, 12:39 PM
- - stevesliva   My brain is hurting because morning in Canberra is...   Jan 28 2020, 03:17 PM
- - Bernard1963   https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?feature=758...   Jan 29 2020, 06:48 AM
- - Roby72   Canberra still tracking VGR2 at 39bits/sec as of F...   Feb 2 2020, 09:35 PM
- - stevesliva   QUOTE (Roby72 @ Feb 2 2020, 04:35 PM) Can...   Feb 3 2020, 04:11 AM
- - stevesliva   There was a post from climber in a another thread ...   Aug 23 2020, 02:52 AM
- - Explorer1   Voyager 2 is doing well! DSN maintenance has p...   Nov 3 2020, 12:58 AM
- - Liss   According to SFOS schedules, first steps in Voyage...   Aug 17 2021, 01:32 PM
- - stevesliva   Tweet from @NSFVoyager2 on Feb22 confirms it, too:...   Aug 17 2021, 04:26 PM
- - stevesliva   Voyager 1 sending odd telemetry, acting normally: ...   May 19 2022, 02:33 AM
- - stevesliva   https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/nasas-voyager...-pow...   Jun 26 2023, 03:25 PM
- - stevesliva   Some sort of commanding error means V2 isn't p...   Jul 31 2023, 02:32 AM
- - climber   It looks like DSN has picked up a carrier signal   Aug 1 2023, 06:38 AM
- - climber   Voyager II, the best of the best is back on line :...   Aug 4 2023, 08:35 PM
- - Bernard1963   Thought I should draw attention to the latest SFOS...   Oct 13 2023, 10:53 AM
- - stevesliva   Optimistically they are exploring strategies to le...   Oct 13 2023, 04:52 PM
- - Explorer1   Press release regarding various strategies of the ...   Oct 21 2023, 04:44 PM
- - climber   https://blogs.nasa.gov/sunspot/ Voyager 1 issue   Dec 12 2023, 05:21 PM
|- - Bernard1963   I would just add. Info from Canberra DSN is that n...   Dec 13 2023, 10:21 AM
- - stevesliva   A close parsing of the nasa update says that, too....   Dec 13 2023, 05:50 PM
- - stevesliva   Speaking of SEU. Found in IEEE Spectrum June 198...   Dec 14 2023, 11:07 PM
- - stevesliva   No news that I've heard this year. Anyone els...   Jan 24 2024, 04:20 AM
- - Bernard1963   From Twitter...... A Voyager update: Engineers are...   Feb 6 2024, 11:31 PM
- - stevesliva   Ars Technica did the good ol' fashioned thing ...   Feb 8 2024, 01:08 AM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (stevesliva @ Feb 7 2024, 05:08 PM)...   Feb 8 2024, 02:04 AM
|- - Brian Swift   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Feb 7 2024, 06:04 PM)...   Feb 8 2024, 07:00 AM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Brian Swift @ Feb 7 2024, 11:00 PM...   Feb 8 2024, 03:10 PM
- - stevesliva   That FDS history is better than anything else I fo...   Feb 8 2024, 07:37 PM
|- - Floyd   QUOTE (stevesliva @ Feb 8 2024, 02:37 PM)...   Feb 9 2024, 01:01 AM
- - mcaplinger   I'm not sure why you take issue with the simpl...   Feb 8 2024, 08:06 PM
- - stevesliva   Oh, I'm not taking any truck with it, just won...   Feb 8 2024, 10:31 PM
- - mcaplinger   The Voyager FDS was designed several years before ...   Feb 9 2024, 02:45 AM
|- - stevesliva   What I gathered from Ars was simply that they...   Feb 9 2024, 06:39 AM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (stevesliva @ Feb 8 2024, 10:39 PM)...   Feb 9 2024, 04:09 PM
- - Doug M.   So, does anyone have a prognosis here? How likely...   Feb 18 2024, 10:51 AM
|- - MahFL   QUOTE (Doug M. @ Feb 18 2024, 10:51 AM) S...   Feb 18 2024, 06:55 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Doug M. @ Feb 18 2024, 02:51 AM) S...   Feb 18 2024, 07:20 PM
- - Doug M.   I wrote a post on the situation here: https://cro...   Feb 21 2024, 06:48 PM
- - mcaplinger   Nice post, but I feel compelled to nit-pick a litt...   Feb 21 2024, 08:55 PM
|- - Tom Tamlyn   What about the Pathfinder models that JPL occasion...   Feb 21 2024, 11:31 PM
||- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Tom Tamlyn @ Feb 21 2024, 03:31 PM...   Feb 21 2024, 11:55 PM
||- - Tom Tamlyn   <groan> Naturally I meant to refer to the S...   Feb 22 2024, 12:37 AM
|- - Doug M.   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Feb 21 2024, 09:55 PM...   Feb 22 2024, 02:06 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Doug M. @ Feb 22 2024, 06:06 AM) A...   Feb 22 2024, 02:43 PM
|- - HSchirmer   QUOTE (mcaplinger)You want to bet on the chances o...   Feb 22 2024, 07:23 PM
|- - stevesliva   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Feb 22 2024, 09:43 AM...   Feb 22 2024, 10:18 PM
- - djellison   The only flight-like rover testbeds in the wild ar...   Feb 22 2024, 02:48 AM
- - Floyd   mcaplinger the PDF you linked is amazing reading. ...   Feb 22 2024, 06:17 PM
- - mcaplinger   It might still be garbage (probably is), but DSS-6...   Feb 27 2024, 03:38 AM
- - stevesliva   NPR had some more color on this, yesterday: https:...   Mar 7 2024, 04:28 PM
- - climber   It looks like we have encouraging progress (sorry ...   Mar 11 2024, 11:17 AM
|- - Tom Tamlyn   From the article: "Today, the Voyager team co...   Mar 13 2024, 09:16 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Tom Tamlyn @ Mar 13 2024, 02:16 PM...   Mar 13 2024, 09:57 PM
- - deedan06   Well they still need a permanent team to deal with...   Mar 13 2024, 10:02 PM
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