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Fastest Spacecraft Ever?!?, Which one is it?
Toma B
post Jan 24 2006, 08:43 AM
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There was statement that recently launched New Horizons is the fastest spacecraft to leave Earth. The velocity was 16.2 km/s relative to the Earth according to "Jonathan's Space Report".
QUOTE
After the Star 48B burn, the payload had reached escape velocity not only with respect to the Earth but also relative to the Sun (The velocity was 16.2 km/s relative to the Earth and I estimate an asymptotic velocity of 12.3 km/s, corresponding to 42.6 km/s relative to the Sun...

So:
New Horizons is fastest to leave Earth at 16.2 km/s (relative to Earth).
Voyager-1 is fastest to leave Solar System at 17.374 km/s (relative to Sun).

Now that is OK. but what is this?
Today's "Astronomy Picture of the Day" features launch of New Horizons and in text bellow image is one particularly interesting link to "Guinness world of records"...
Guinness world of records;
There "Mr. Guinness" claims that the fastest spacecrafts ever, were two Solar probes "Helios 1&2"...According to him those spacecrafts had speed of 252,800 km/h which is staggering 70.2 km/s...BUT RELATIVE TO WHAT????? mad.gif mad.gif mad.gif mad.gif
Can somebody explain this?


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The scientist does not study nature because it is useful; he studies it because he delights in it, and he delights in it because it is beautiful.
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My "Astrophotos" gallery on flickr...
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dvandorn
post May 2 2006, 08:12 PM
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Yeah -- you'd end up with a pretty ragged, hole-ridden sail/solar panel by the time you got out to the Kuiper Belt. How are you going to create a really, really thin/lightweight sail/solar panel that can stand up to the high-energy dust impacts it's going to face? Gonna redirect some of that energy into intense magnetic fields that divert dust particles electrostatically?

Before we get too involved in discussions of new propulsion technologies, I will make the cautionary noise, here, that when Mike Griffin went before Congress last week, he was asked point-blank about new propulsion technology research. He said that NASA's immediate goals (including the full range of VSE goals) do not require any new propulsion technologies. He said that almost every NASA program, with the exception of the Shuttle/ISS wind-down, has been cut or delayed, including propulsion technology research. He said that there will be *no* new propulsion research for a decade or more.

BTW, he also said that, since Congress and this Administration refused to give NASA any additional monies to repair damage to Michoud, the Stennis Space Center, and the Kennedy Space Center incurred during last year's hurricane season, he was even stealing from the Shuttle/ISS funds to cover a roughly half-billion-dollar repair bill.

-the other Doug


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ljk4-1
post May 2 2006, 09:19 PM
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QUOTE (dvandorn @ May 2 2006, 04:12 PM) *
Before we get too involved in discussions of new propulsion technologies, I will make the cautionary noise, here, that when Mike Griffin went before Congress last week, he was asked point-blank about new propulsion technology research. He said that NASA's immediate goals (including the full range of VSE goals) do not require any new propulsion technologies. He said that almost every NASA program, with the exception of the Shuttle/ISS wind-down, has been cut or delayed, including propulsion technology research. He said that there will be *no* new propulsion research for a decade or more.


What a frightening and depressing statement. Does Griffin think that just
because he won't let NASA engineers and space scientists develop new
concepts of propulsion that other equally talented and visionary people
in other countries won't pursue this course? Or that he might drive US
talent to more receptive places?

The next time I hear Griffin or anyone else say that the USA must remain
at the forefront of space exploration and technology, I will remember this
statement.

It will be sadly ironic if in 2025 we have a handful of astronauts on the
Moon while the other space nations are sending probes to every planet
in the Sol system and beyond.


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"After having some business dealings with men, I am occasionally chagrined,
and feel as if I had done some wrong, and it is hard to forget the ugly circumstance.
I see that such intercourse long continued would make one thoroughly prosaic, hard,
and coarse. But the longest intercourse with Nature, though in her rudest moods, does
not thus harden and make coarse. A hard, sensible man whom we liken to a rock is
indeed much harder than a rock. From hard, coarse, insensible men with whom I have
no sympathy, I go to commune with the rocks, whose hearts are comparatively soft."

- Henry David Thoreau, November 15, 1853

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Posts in this topic
- Toma B   Fastest Spacecraft Ever?!?   Jan 24 2006, 08:43 AM
- - ugordan   QUOTE (Toma B @ Jan 24 2006, 09:43 AM)BUT REL...   Jan 24 2006, 08:53 AM
- - Alan Stern   QUOTE (Toma B @ Jan 24 2006, 08:43 AM)There w...   Jan 24 2006, 09:01 AM
- - edstrick   The fastest spacecraft ever, relative to what it...   Jan 24 2006, 10:21 AM
- - odave   Here's a pointless activity for the space sim ...   Jan 24 2006, 02:52 PM
|- - ljk4-1   QUOTE (odave @ Jan 24 2006, 09:52 AM)Here...   Jan 24 2006, 02:59 PM
- - tasp   I can't find the thread here right now, but th...   Jan 24 2006, 03:15 PM
|- - ljk4-1   QUOTE (tasp @ Jan 24 2006, 10:15 AM)I can...   Jan 24 2006, 03:24 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ Jan 24 2006, 04:24 PM)Ho...   Jan 24 2006, 03:47 PM
- - RNeuhaus   Ulysses still holds as the fastest escape velocity...   Jan 24 2006, 03:57 PM
|- - Alan Stern   QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Jan 24 2006, 03:57 PM)Ulyss...   Jan 24 2006, 06:23 PM
- - PhilCo126   I guess it's pretty difficult to come up with ...   Jan 24 2006, 05:12 PM
- - remcook   "I guess it's pretty difficult to come up...   Jan 24 2006, 05:37 PM
- - djellison   Who's up for Top Trumps. I think Alan just won...   Jan 24 2006, 08:53 PM
|- - BPCooper   NH is fastest to be propelled away from Earth. The...   Jan 24 2006, 09:14 PM
|- - Bob Shaw   QUOTE (djellison @ Jan 24 2006, 09:53 PM)Who...   Jan 24 2006, 11:06 PM
|- - David   QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Jan 24 2006, 11:06 PM)Not f...   Jan 24 2006, 11:27 PM
- - djellison   My Estes two-stage Mongoose would shame an Atlas V...   Jan 24 2006, 11:55 PM
- - ljk4-1   Via Solar Array to the Outer Planets New Scientis...   May 2 2006, 06:18 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ May 2 2006, 06:18 PM...   May 2 2006, 06:28 PM
|- - ljk4-1   QUOTE (djellison @ May 2 2006, 02:28 PM) ...   May 2 2006, 06:34 PM
- - Bill Harris   ...but, as importantly, how long to decelerate fro...   May 2 2006, 07:11 PM
- - tty   Also the payload would probably have to have some ...   May 2 2006, 07:38 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (tty @ May 2 2006, 08:38 PM) Also t...   May 8 2006, 04:04 PM
- - dvandorn   Yeah -- you'd end up with a pretty ragged, hol...   May 2 2006, 08:12 PM
|- - ljk4-1   QUOTE (dvandorn @ May 2 2006, 04:12 PM) B...   May 2 2006, 09:19 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ May 2 2006, 09:19 PM...   May 2 2006, 10:08 PM
|- - Stephen   QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ May 2 2006, 09:19 PM...   May 3 2006, 01:41 AM
- - ljk4-1   My concern is that the VSE is going to become Apol...   May 4 2006, 11:40 AM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ May 4 2006, 12:40 PM...   May 4 2006, 11:49 AM
|- - Stephen   QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ May 4 2006, 11:40 AM...   May 5 2006, 06:56 AM
- - ljk4-1   G. Landis had a similar idea to Meyer's one ye...   May 8 2006, 02:54 PM
- - djellison   Well - consider a 1 gramme projectile at 10km/sec ...   May 8 2006, 04:06 PM
|- - ugordan   That's true, but consider what are the odds of...   May 8 2006, 04:13 PM
- - djellison   I wasn't suggesting we would encounter 1 gramm...   May 8 2006, 04:16 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (djellison @ May 8 2006, 05:16 PM) ...   May 8 2006, 04:19 PM
- - djellison   Oop- yes Doug   May 8 2006, 04:23 PM
- - DonPMitchell   I believe it is the case that it takes far more en...   May 10 2006, 10:37 PM
- - mchan   If one were not permitted to cheat and use one or ...   May 11 2006, 01:49 AM
- - Phil Stooke   No, that would just be the method. Phil   May 11 2006, 03:18 AM
|- - mchan   QUOTE (Phil Stooke @ May 10 2006, 08:18 P...   May 11 2006, 08:41 PM
|- - Bob Shaw   QUOTE (mchan @ May 11 2006, 09:41 PM) I h...   May 11 2006, 09:23 PM
- - djellison   Yes - it seems unintuitive at first, but the numbe...   May 11 2006, 07:46 AM
- - edstrick   "...square of the velocity...." When we...   May 11 2006, 11:03 AM


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