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Venus Express
Guest_BruceMoomaw_*
post Jun 9 2006, 01:08 AM
Post #196





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Well, yes, but where would the Europeans find someone that dotty? (By the way, a recent E-mail exchange with Keith -- of which I will spare you the sordid details, except that it started out with me trying to compliment him on something -- has confirmed again that his website should feature one of those warning labels that says, "Caution: Contains Nuts".)
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RNeuhaus
post Jun 9 2006, 04:00 AM
Post #197


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This seems that ESA is facing against the powerful democratic way which is the WEB where everybody is the witness of his taxpayer.

Rodolfo
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hendric
post Jun 9 2006, 04:46 AM
Post #198


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Pillinger, duh!

I mean, a Beagle-2 RINGTONE?!?


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Bob Shaw
post Jun 9 2006, 02:39 PM
Post #199


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QUOTE (lyford @ Jun 8 2006, 02:52 AM) *
Yes, I hear they plan daily releases of pics, a la MER. (Venusian days.)


Very funny! But perhaps all too true...


QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Jun 9 2006, 02:08 AM) *
Well, yes, but where would the Europeans find someone that dotty? (By the way, a recent E-mail exchange with Keith -- of which I will spare you the sordid details, except that it started out with me trying to compliment him on something -- has confirmed again that his website should feature one of those warning labels that says, "Caution: Contains Nuts".)


Bruce:

Well, I'm glad he doesn't lurk here, that's all I can say!

(C'mon Keith, 'fess up! We really do *love* ya, baby (in a stern, man-hug way, except for Ustrax, in whose case it's even more robust!)).

Bob Shaw


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ljk4-1
post Jun 12 2006, 02:16 PM
Post #200


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Venus Express Commissioning Phase Completed

Paris, France (SPX) Jun 12, 2006

After 207 days of flight, 43 orbits around Venus and many test activities, Venus Express formally completed its commissioning phase June 3 and entered the routine science phase, ESA announced last week.

http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Venus_Ex..._Completed.html


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"After having some business dealings with men, I am occasionally chagrined,
and feel as if I had done some wrong, and it is hard to forget the ugly circumstance.
I see that such intercourse long continued would make one thoroughly prosaic, hard,
and coarse. But the longest intercourse with Nature, though in her rudest moods, does
not thus harden and make coarse. A hard, sensible man whom we liken to a rock is
indeed much harder than a rock. From hard, coarse, insensible men with whom I have
no sympathy, I go to commune with the rocks, whose hearts are comparatively soft."

- Henry David Thoreau, November 15, 1853

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ustrax
post Jun 12 2006, 03:15 PM
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QUOTE (ustrax @ Jun 8 2006, 05:04 PM) *
About the updates let's wait untill the 13th to confirm their periodicity... wink.gif


They're right on schedule... smile.gif

http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object/in...fobjectid=39386


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djellison
post Jun 12 2006, 04:48 PM
Post #202


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QUOTE (hendric @ Jun 9 2006, 05:46 AM) *
I mean, a Beagle-2 RINGTONE?!?


Guilty - I had that on my Nokia 3210 ohmy.gif

Doug
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ustrax
post Jun 13 2006, 09:18 AM
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B)-->
QUOTE(Toma B @ Jun 8 2006, 02:04 PM) *

Yes I have but I got no reply... sad.gif
[/quote]

Here's an enlightning one from Monica Talevi (Science Information Manager), which Mr. Don McCoy believed to be the proper person to answer my question:

Let me try to answer your note. As you noted already, Venus Express started
its nominal science phase on 4th June, starting its observations on final
orbit.
As far as the presentation of scientific results is concerned, we are well
aware that our readers have to be a little patient....In fact, much
differently from NASA, ESA - by its constitution - doesn't fund the payload
(scientific instruments) of its spacecraft, which are on the contrary funded
by European Scientific institutes or National Space Agencies. The payload
scientists have priority right to use the scientific data for a few months
from their reception; only after this time ESA can claim back its full
property of the data.

Clearly, precise agreements are in place bewteen ESA and the payload
scientists as far as the use of PR images are concerned, but any delivery of
public outreach material must pass through a process that takes some time,
because the parties involved are several.

In any case, do not worry: soon you will see on the web new data and new
material: we are at work on it. So...stay tuned!


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The Messenger
post Jun 13 2006, 03:20 PM
Post #204


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This is encourgaging, but the time lag can be disheartening. It would be helpful to have access to all of the Huygens data by now...who knows - something in the data might have pushed a Titan/Enceladus mission ahead of Europa on the wish list...
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ljk4-1
post Jun 13 2006, 03:22 PM
Post #205


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Ad astra per bureaucracia.


--------------------
"After having some business dealings with men, I am occasionally chagrined,
and feel as if I had done some wrong, and it is hard to forget the ugly circumstance.
I see that such intercourse long continued would make one thoroughly prosaic, hard,
and coarse. But the longest intercourse with Nature, though in her rudest moods, does
not thus harden and make coarse. A hard, sensible man whom we liken to a rock is
indeed much harder than a rock. From hard, coarse, insensible men with whom I have
no sympathy, I go to commune with the rocks, whose hearts are comparatively soft."

- Henry David Thoreau, November 15, 1853

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Guest_DonPMitchell_*
post Jun 13 2006, 04:48 PM
Post #206





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QUOTE (ustrax @ Jun 13 2006, 02:18 AM) *
In fact, much
differently from NASA, ESA - by its constitution - doesn't fund the payload
(scientific instruments) of its spacecraft, which are on the contrary funded
by European Scientific institutes or National Space Agencies. The payload
scientists have priority right to use the scientific data for a few months
from their reception; only after this time ESA can claim back its full
property of the data.


But who funds those scientific institutes and agencies? The scientists didn't pay for Venus Express, European tax payers did, either through ESA or through other agencies. Also, the cost of the science payloads is often rather trivial compared to the cost of carrying them to Venus or Mars. It is very hard to argue that those images are not public property.

The University of Arizona built the camera on Huygens, and those pictures were released immediately. Nobody at U of A would say "these pictures belong to us!" I think criticism of this practice of witholding images and data should continue. In the long run, it will be good for ESA to change its attitudes, and it will get more public support.
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dilo
post Jun 13 2006, 06:01 PM
Post #207


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Cannot avoid to firmly agree with you, Don.
I think we european tax payers should be hungry about this stupid policy!


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helvick
post Jun 13 2006, 09:39 PM
Post #208


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QUOTE (dilo @ Jun 13 2006, 07:01 PM) *
Cannot avoid to firmly agree with you, Don.
I think we european tax payers should be hungry about this stupid policy!

I could not agree more. I can understand that ESA may well be limited in what they can do with regard to current missions where contracts may limit what they can and cannot do but the MER\Cassini examples have proven beyond doubt that there is a right way to do these things and it we need to make sure that in future the practice of releasing as much immediate data as possible becomes the minimum accepted practive.
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Guest_AlexBlackwell_*
post Jun 19 2006, 10:09 PM
Post #209





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There are two interesting articles in the June 2006 issue of Astronomy and Geophysics: "Venus Express arrives" by Andrew Coates and "Venus: The corona conundrum" by Peter M Grindrod and Trudi Hoogenboom.

Note for those who don't subscribe to A&G: The full Grindrod and Hoogenboom article can be downloaded here (~488 Kb PDF).

This post has been edited by AlexBlackwell: Jun 20 2006, 12:21 AM
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ustrax
post Jun 21 2006, 09:44 AM
Post #210


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'Report for Period 11 June to 17 June 2006

During the reporting period, Venus Express experienced its first Safe Mode since launch. This occured on 12 June, DoY 163, at the end of a data recovery action due to a ground station problem on DoY 162.'

http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object/in...fobjectid=39400


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