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Martian Cave Probe?, Designs for the DEEP Search for Life
Shaka
post Nov 14 2007, 12:18 AM
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Does anyone consider it worthwhile to speculate on how we might explore Martian caves or lava tubes for the traces of life - past or present? I have not yet run across any 'official' proposals for "spelunker probes", so perhaps we could have some fun and get in on the ground floor with some feasible early designs. With the engineering and scientific expertise we have at UMSF we should be able to whittle down the possible features for such a rover to a practical core. If the planned surface scrapers and drillers don't turn up conclusive evidence to answer The Big Question, can we justify a search of the Martian Underground?

I can envisage a RTG-powered rover that enters a cave, or rappels down a skylight opening, leaving a base communication stage outside connected to it with a fiber-optic umbilical cable. Some form of laser or other illumination - in the visible and/or infrared - would presumably be required. How many of the MSL instruments could be included? What novel instruments would be appropriate? What is the optimal size and mobility design? 'Do we yet have 'hot' prospects for accessible caves? How should we choose the best candidates?

We can leave this to some JPL bright spark to develop, or we can dive right in. Any takers? smile.gif wheel.gif


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My Grandpa goes to Mars every day and all I get are these lousy T-shirts!
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Cugel
post Nov 14 2007, 01:20 PM
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Elevation is only a problem if you come in on a chute. If you have a nice powerful descent rocket you can land anywhere on Mars. I know this will do something ugly to your budget but powered EDL on Mars must be developed for manned missions anyway. So, in true Zubrinian style, let's just suppose we have that technology and somebody has payed for it.
The good thing is that the landing ellipse will now be down to a few meters or so. We can do a pinpoint landing right next to the hole in the ground.
So, maybe we don't even need a rover type lander (to get to the hole), just a big boom might be sufficient to deploy the probe. (This is the optimistic part)
Also, I don't see the cable problems nprev mentioned before. If you can lower something many miles into an ocean on Earth it surely must be possible to do that in a cave on Mars.
The whole shebang (lander + probe) can be solar powered, so accept for the EDL hardware I don't see why it would cost many billions (MSL class maybe?).

Another idea if you don't like that cable: just drop a battery powered probe into the hole and dangle an antenna which is connected to the lander a meter deep or so in the cave . That would be good enough for a radio link. With airbag technology the fall must be survivable for the probe (which could be pretty small and simple anyway).
Probably carry more than one of these probes anyway. The probes could be deployed into the hole by shooting them out of an airgun, so the lander could actually be quite some distance from the rim.
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- Shaka   Martian Cave Probe?   Nov 14 2007, 12:18 AM
- - nprev   Cool idea, but I don't think it'd ever fly...   Nov 14 2007, 12:52 AM
- - dvandorn   As far as I know, however, all of the lava tube ca...   Nov 14 2007, 01:54 AM
- - nprev   Great point, oDoug. Hopefully <wish mode> we...   Nov 14 2007, 03:27 AM
- - Shaka   You get my drift, nprev. Elevation could be a cru...   Nov 14 2007, 06:20 AM
|- - dburt   QUOTE (Shaka @ Nov 13 2007, 11:20 PM) ......   Nov 15 2007, 10:22 PM
- - Cugel   Elevation is only a problem if you come in on a ch...   Nov 14 2007, 01:20 PM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (Cugel @ Nov 14 2007, 05:20 AM) Als...   Nov 14 2007, 04:12 PM
|- - Cugel   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 14 2007, 05:12 PM) I w...   Nov 15 2007, 11:59 AM
- - centsworth_II   If you're looking for microbe-friendly habitat...   Nov 14 2007, 03:59 PM
- - Shaka   Thanks, guys, for your input. Clearly this is not...   Nov 15 2007, 04:56 AM
- - Shaka   Good fundamental astrobiological question, Cugel. ...   Nov 15 2007, 08:21 PM
|- - Cugel   QUOTE (Shaka @ Nov 15 2007, 09:21 PM) Goo...   Nov 16 2007, 03:09 PM
- - Shaka   For sure, Prof Don! Any kind of vent or other...   Nov 15 2007, 11:09 PM
- - nprev   Like the spider, still hate the cable. I wonder if...   Nov 16 2007, 01:13 AM
- - Shaka   Don't understand your problem with Shelob...   Nov 16 2007, 02:39 AM
- - nprev   I keep thinking of the cable getting wedged betwee...   Nov 16 2007, 02:48 AM
- - mchan   All I gotta say is you guys here have designed des...   Nov 16 2007, 03:02 AM
- - Shaka   Devilsfood, to be precise. All we need is to cult...   Nov 16 2007, 04:09 AM
- - nprev   Shaka, let's compromise. Shelob can drag a fib...   Nov 16 2007, 01:45 PM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 16 2007, 08:45 AM) She...   Nov 16 2007, 03:41 PM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (centsworth_II @ Nov 16 2007, 07:41...   Nov 17 2007, 01:57 AM
- - Juramike   Hmmm...I'd worry about possible backtracking. ...   Nov 16 2007, 04:05 PM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (Juramike @ Nov 16 2007, 11:05 AM) ...   Nov 16 2007, 05:41 PM
- - Juramike   At some point we will need to go in and explore ha...   Nov 16 2007, 06:14 PM
- - Shaka   For starters I'll concede that no interplaneta...   Nov 16 2007, 09:52 PM
- - Del Palmer   Would a modified version of LEMUR be up to the job...   Nov 16 2007, 10:59 PM
- - Shaka   LEMUR How sweet it is! I'm relieved to s...   Nov 17 2007, 01:32 AM
- - Shaka   Helllll, yessss, nprev! It was about 25 years...   Nov 17 2007, 05:21 AM
- - nprev   ...I was an ET, sailed several times on the Albatr...   Nov 17 2007, 11:23 AM
- - Shaka   "navigate back" Wow, you don't want...   Nov 17 2007, 06:55 PM
- - Shaka   Expanding further on the subject of Shelob's i...   Nov 17 2007, 09:25 PM
- - nprev   All over it, Boss! Gonna stick to my guns on...   Nov 17 2007, 11:29 PM
- - tanjent   Getting any hardware to Mars is going to be expens...   Nov 20 2007, 04:07 PM
- - Shaka   Scouting is good. Expensive is bad. But good and ...   Nov 22 2007, 07:25 AM


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