IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

43 Pages V  « < 39 40 41 42 43 >  
Reply to this topicStart new topic
InSight Surface Operations, 26 Nov 2018-
atomoid
post Jun 5 2019, 10:05 PM
Post #601


Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 765
Joined: 15-March 05
From: Santa Cruz, CA
Member No.: 196



Good to hear they are finally going to try something out!
The grapple seems to be optimized for securing specifically designed handles, but as we've seen such challenges spark ingenuity in the past there will be no shortage of novel approaches put forward, if complete instrument deployment failure is assumed after exhausting all safer approaches, then with nothing to lose and power to spare, push comes to shove more ambitious possibilities to emerge.
Worst case, could the grapple secure an accessible portion of played-out tether between its 'fingers' and be able to relocate even a reclined probe back to a useable place whether it be the original hole or a new divot crudely scraped by the shovel? just spooling whimsicals here but the grapple might even be able to mimic the effect of the tether spool enclosure and hover the probe to slowly lower over the course of the percussion process. any such Hail-Mary approach would surely be way down the road.

Found this Q&A article regarding their latest plans.
Here's to hoping the pressure of the arm can induce friction enough to help the mole establish and sustain its own friction as it descends into presumably more compacted soils, assuming that implies increased friction to work with, but it may just mean creating a more resilient hollow in which to get stuck.
Relocating the probe: "the mole was never designed to be handled that way" at some point they could try to handle it in a way it was NOT designed for.
No-friction scenario: As a lay person, I'm havent studied up and am somewhat out of sync with accepted assumptions, not attempting to second guess, but trying to understand why just below the surface it would not be expected to be a sand and dust covered jumbled rockpile atop bedrock, as that seems to be what we see elsewhere. they suggest a few percent chance of hitting rock, i would have assumed it over 90% within the first meter. But anyways, since the no-friction scenario seems to fit with the data, was SEIS used to determine if the probe is or is not hitting rock? I'd assume SEIS would yield a very different signal if is hitting rock vs the no-friction 'bouncing' scenario, or maybe the signal isnt that different if the sand/dust gets compacted enough and resemble a signal from rock.?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Phil Stooke
post Jun 6 2019, 02:11 AM
Post #602


Solar System Cartographer
****

Group: Members
Posts: 7928
Joined: 5-April 05
From: Canada
Member No.: 227



I think the SEIS team did listen very carefully to the hammering to help the diagnostics.

Anyway, it looks like I will get my wish and have some more events to map later this month. The idea of pressing on the surface to try to increase friction leads me to think a few bearing tests (pressing down on the surface to see how it responds) might have been useful, but hindsight is always helpful. Or in this case, not!

Phil


--------------------
... because the Solar System ain't gonna map itself.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
nprev
post Jun 6 2019, 02:33 AM
Post #603


Senior Member
****

Group: Admin
Posts: 8373
Joined: 8-December 05
From: Los Angeles
Member No.: 602



More hindsight/speculation: I wonder if SEIS could have been used to 'map' a small area of the soil down to a depth of several centimeters by moving the mole to slightly different locations and actuating the driver while the mole was still caged in the assembly. Might've been able to infer some subsurface rocks that way.


--------------------
A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PaulH51
post Jun 6 2019, 06:24 AM
Post #604


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1716
Joined: 30-January 13
From: Penang, Malaysia.
Member No.: 6853



Not sure why they have to wait until the end of June to start lifting the housing, but the grapple is currently placed above the pickup pin on HP3

Contained in the same release was news regarding the detection during May 22, 2019 of what is believed to be a marsquake of magnitude 3.0.

In a tweet from SEIS they stated that it was 'five to ten times more powerful than the previous ones' (back in April) Hopefully that could have provided some early data on the interior structure of the planet, or maybe they're waiting for a bigger one for that smile.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PaulH51
post Jun 6 2019, 12:58 PM
Post #605


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1716
Joined: 30-January 13
From: Penang, Malaysia.
Member No.: 6853



The HP3 mission blog from Instrument Lead Tilman Spohn has now been updated with some additional details not in the press release
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
stevesliva
post Jun 6 2019, 01:49 PM
Post #606


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1396
Joined: 14-October 05
From: Vermont
Member No.: 530



QUOTE (PaulH51 @ Jun 6 2019, 01:24 AM) *
Not sure why they have to wait until the end of June to start lifting the housing, but the grapple is currently placed above the pickup pin on HP3

May just be start / end semantics. Because I read everything as saying they're starting ASAP, but that it will be deliberate. From Tilman @ DLR:

QUOTE
a operations scheme has been designed where the lifting occurs in several steps with careful examinations on the way. This is then the major reason why the operation will take a while, until mid next month or possibly even later.

For those trying to parse that blog entry, the ideal spot 1 is unreachable without moving the support structure. Spot 2 is also unreachable. Only "Achievable Spot 2" can be pressed on without moving the structure. The graph indicates that even unachievable spot 2 is marginal, so they really think Spot 1 is necessary... so they conclude it must be moved.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PaulH51
post Jun 9 2019, 07:43 AM
Post #607


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1716
Joined: 30-January 13
From: Penang, Malaysia.
Member No.: 6853



Hard to be sure, but it appears close to a capture smile.gif (sol 189 IDC GIF)
Attached Image
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PaulH51
post Jun 13 2019, 11:21 AM
Post #608


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1716
Joined: 30-January 13
From: Penang, Malaysia.
Member No.: 6853



The grapple on the Robotic arm that is currently attached to HP3 was lifted a little on sol 193 as seen in the 4 IDC frames that were acquired close to sunset. The structure was not lifted off the ground, but raising the arm appears to have taken up the slack on the lifting pin. The latest of those 4 IDC frames is time stamped as 5:30 pm local time, so unless they are planning a little more lifting in twilight, we may have to await until tomorrow to see the first lift that could take place this week link
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
fredk
post Jun 13 2019, 02:11 PM
Post #609


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3932
Joined: 17-January 05
Member No.: 152



A correction at the bottom of that page says the move is planned for later in June, as we'd heard before.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PaulH51
post Jun 13 2019, 07:14 PM
Post #610


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1716
Joined: 30-January 13
From: Penang, Malaysia.
Member No.: 6853



QUOTE (fredk @ Jun 13 2019, 10:11 PM) *
A correction at the bottom of that page says the move is planned for later in June, as we'd heard before.

And there was me getting ready for the lift (sigh)
Small print, always look for and read the small print...
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PaulH51
post Jun 14 2019, 12:44 PM
Post #611


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1716
Joined: 30-January 13
From: Penang, Malaysia.
Member No.: 6853



DLR HP3 Blog Logbook entry 14 June 2019:

QUOTE
The support structure lifting operation has begun! The GIF below shows how the grapple of the arm grabs the hook at the top of the SSA.

The lifting is foreseen to start on 22 June - first at 12 centimetres, then at 25 centimetres on 25 June and, finally, on 28 June the structure should be completely lifted and moved about 10 centimetres towards the lander.


link to full blog
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
nogal
post Jun 14 2019, 06:03 PM
Post #612


Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 328
Joined: 15-June 09
From: Lisbon, Portugal
Member No.: 4824



Above the blog entry for June 6 there is an animated GIF (of the June 14 entry).
The shadow of the grapple helped me understand the SSA's hook capture.
Fernando
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Phil Stooke
post Jun 20 2019, 07:53 PM
Post #613


Solar System Cartographer
****

Group: Members
Posts: 7928
Joined: 5-April 05
From: Canada
Member No.: 227



This is my suggestion for the identity of the hill seen to the northwest and illustrated a few posts back. I think candidate 2 is a better bet than candidate 1.

Phil

Attached Image


--------------------
... because the Solar System ain't gonna map itself.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Phil Stooke
post Jun 23 2019, 07:49 PM
Post #614


Solar System Cartographer
****

Group: Members
Posts: 7928
Joined: 5-April 05
From: Canada
Member No.: 227



Sol 203 - the HP3 was lifted a few cm.

Phil


--------------------
... because the Solar System ain't gonna map itself.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
alan
post Jun 23 2019, 09:06 PM
Post #615


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 1869
Joined: 20-November 04
From: Iowa
Member No.: 110



Someone is claiming the mole is out:

https://twitter.com/Simon11129621/status/1142858628568891392

Attached Image

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

43 Pages V  « < 39 40 41 42 43 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 22nd July 2019 - 10:50 PM
RULES AND GUIDELINES
Please read the Forum Rules and Guidelines before posting.

IMAGE COPYRIGHT
Images posted on UnmannedSpaceflight.com may be copyrighted. Do not reproduce without permission. Read here for further information on space images and copyright.

OPINIONS AND MODERATION
Opinions expressed on UnmannedSpaceflight.com are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of UnmannedSpaceflight.com or The Planetary Society. The all-volunteer UnmannedSpaceflight.com moderation team is wholly independent of The Planetary Society. The Planetary Society has no influence over decisions made by the UnmannedSpaceflight.com moderators.
SUPPORT THE FORUM
Unmannedspaceflight.com is a project of the Planetary Society and is funded by donations from visitors and members. Help keep this forum up and running by contributing here.