IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Europa Subsurface Ocean
ugordan
post Nov 22 2005, 10:53 AM
Post #1


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3648
Joined: 1-October 05
From: Croatia
Member No.: 523



Regarding the very real possibility Europa harbors an ocean underneath the ice, I'm wondering whether there have been any estimates on how long such an ocean might have been sustained (I'm assuming it's still there today). Are we talking about the entire history of Europa, billions of years or a much more recent thing, only a few millions? I know Enceladus, which recently turned out to be much warmer inside than expected, could have been periodically heated, but not on very long timescales.
I'm primarily interested because of the habitability factor, obviously an ocean which freezes out every once and a while would not make for a good incubator to possible life.

Also, supposedly all tidal heating on Europa would cease now, how long would it take for the subsurface to freeze out, that is, what are the thermal conductive properties of the surface ice?

Admittedly, I haven't done much research on the subject and if the question was already asked before, I apologize.


--------------------
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
 
Start new topic
Replies
Jeff7
post Jan 27 2006, 01:57 AM
Post #2


Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 477
Joined: 2-March 05
Member No.: 180



Link was truncated.wink.gif

There we go

I wonder if there are any plans to gather samples from those lakes?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Bob Shaw
post Jan 27 2006, 06:54 PM
Post #3


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2488
Joined: 17-April 05
From: Glasgow, Scotland, UK
Member No.: 239



QUOTE (Jeff7 @ Jan 27 2006, 02:57 AM)
Link was truncated.wink.gif

There we go

I wonder if there are any plans to gather samples from those lakes?
*


Jeff:

It's been discussed, but would be very difficult to do without contaminating the lakes themselves. Even getting *near* the fluid water is hazardous, sadly (for the lakes). It may, however, be too late anyway, as drilling close by may already have penetrated the 'no go' zone required for a sterile investigation.

Bob Shaw


--------------------
Remember: Time Flies like the wind - but Fruit Flies like bananas!
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ljk4-1
post Feb 8 2006, 12:51 PM
Post #4


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2454
Joined: 8-July 05
From: NGC 5907
Member No.: 430



Newly Discovered Antarctic Lakes

http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Newsroom/...p3?img_id=17176

To quote:

"Scientists recently published the first thorough description of the size, depth, and origin of these two large lakes, called 90° East Lake (for its longitude) and Sovetskaya Lake (for the Russian research station that was unknowingly built over top it many years ago)."

Now I truly wonder how pristine at least the latter lake is.


--------------------
"After having some business dealings with men, I am occasionally chagrined,
and feel as if I had done some wrong, and it is hard to forget the ugly circumstance.
I see that such intercourse long continued would make one thoroughly prosaic, hard,
and coarse. But the longest intercourse with Nature, though in her rudest moods, does
not thus harden and make coarse. A hard, sensible man whom we liken to a rock is
indeed much harder than a rock. From hard, coarse, insensible men with whom I have
no sympathy, I go to commune with the rocks, whose hearts are comparatively soft."

- Henry David Thoreau, November 15, 1853

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ljk4-1
post Feb 17 2006, 04:23 PM
Post #5


Senior Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2454
Joined: 8-July 05
From: NGC 5907
Member No.: 430



Special Public Event

Europa: Life Beneath the Ice?

What lies beneath the ice of Jupiter’s frozen moon Europa?

Almost certainly, a liquid water ocean.

Could life have evolved in such an icebound sea, growing in the darkness of eternal winter?

Europa is one of the solar system’s most fascinating worlds, having the precious commodity of liquid water, fascinating geology, and even the possibility of life. Numerous science committees have judged it as the top priority for outer solar system exploration. Join the NASA Astrobiology Institute Europa Focus Group and The Planetary Society for an eye-opening presentation about Europa, how life can evolve in unexpected places, and the type of mission that might be sent to answer some of our questions. Steven Quale will show clips from the film, Aliens of the Deep. Time for Q&A with the speakers will follow the presentation.

Admission is Free.

Seating is limited. First come, first served.

SPEAKERS:

Chris McKay, NASA Ames, Planetary Scientist
Torrence Johnson, Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Galileo Project Scientist
Bob Pappalardo, University of Colorado, Boulder, Planetary Scientist
Steven Quale, filmmaker and co-Director of Aliens of the Deep
Bruce Betts, Moderator, The Planetary Society, Director of Projects

Date: Sunday, February 26, 2006
Time: 7:00 – 9:00 PM

Location: NASA Ames Research Center
Building 943, Eagle Room
Moffett Field, CA
Directions: Exit off Hwy 101

This event is presented by The Planetary Societyin affiliation with The NASA Astrobiology Institute Europa Focus Group.

If you need additional information, please contact The Planetary Society, 626-793-5100

http://www.planetary.org/programs/projects...ropa_event.html


--------------------
"After having some business dealings with men, I am occasionally chagrined,
and feel as if I had done some wrong, and it is hard to forget the ugly circumstance.
I see that such intercourse long continued would make one thoroughly prosaic, hard,
and coarse. But the longest intercourse with Nature, though in her rudest moods, does
not thus harden and make coarse. A hard, sensible man whom we liken to a rock is
indeed much harder than a rock. From hard, coarse, insensible men with whom I have
no sympathy, I go to commune with the rocks, whose hearts are comparatively soft."

- Henry David Thoreau, November 15, 1853

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Posts in this topic
- ugordan   Europa Subsurface Ocean   Nov 22 2005, 10:53 AM
- - Richard Trigaux   There are already a topic about an Europa orbiter ...   Nov 22 2005, 11:46 AM
- - tasp   I don't imagine I'm an expert on this, but...   Nov 22 2005, 02:47 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (tasp @ Nov 22 2005, 04:47 PM)I don...   Nov 22 2005, 03:35 PM
||- - Richard Trigaux   Europa ice crust is not much thicker than the Anta...   Nov 22 2005, 05:43 PM
|- - Bob Shaw   QUOTE (tasp @ Nov 22 2005, 03:47 PM)IIRC, mic...   Nov 22 2005, 06:21 PM
|- - Richard Trigaux   QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Nov 22 2005, 06:21 PM)One a...   Nov 22 2005, 08:38 PM
|- - RNeuhaus   QUOTE (Richard Trigaux @ Nov 22 2005, 03:38 P...   Nov 22 2005, 09:13 PM
||- - helvick   QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Nov 22 2005, 10:13 PM)Out o...   Nov 22 2005, 09:26 PM
||- - Richard Trigaux   QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Nov 22 2005, 09:13 PM)As fa...   Nov 23 2005, 07:06 AM
|- - tty   QUOTE (Richard Trigaux @ Nov 22 2005, 10:38 P...   Nov 24 2005, 07:42 PM
|- - RNeuhaus   QUOTE (tty @ Nov 24 2005, 02:42 PM)That's...   Nov 24 2005, 09:01 PM
|- - tty   QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Nov 24 2005, 11:01 PM)South...   Nov 24 2005, 09:51 PM
- - Rob Pinnegar   The history of Europa has to be very closely tied ...   Nov 22 2005, 03:36 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   Virtually all the papers on the subject have concl...   Nov 22 2005, 10:43 PM
- - Richard Trigaux   Thank you BruceMoomaw to quote papers which more o...   Nov 23 2005, 07:22 AM
- - RNeuhaus   Thanks to Richard and Helvick for the reference. I...   Nov 24 2005, 04:21 AM
|- - elakdawalla   QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Nov 23 2005, 08:21 PM)Thank...   Nov 24 2005, 04:36 AM
- - Myran   QUOTE RNeuhaus said: I am still puzzled  of t...   Nov 24 2005, 11:40 AM
|- - Richard Trigaux   QUOTE (Myran @ Nov 24 2005, 11:40 AM)If there...   Nov 24 2005, 02:18 PM
|- - RNeuhaus   QUOTE (Myran @ Nov 24 2005, 06:40 AM)Did you ...   Nov 24 2005, 03:34 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   QUOTE (Myran @ Nov 24 2005, 11:40 AM)Its not ...   Nov 24 2005, 03:02 PM
|- - Richard Trigaux   QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Nov 24 2005, 03:02 PM)It...   Nov 24 2005, 04:21 PM
- - Decepticon   When I visit Italy (Calabria) is the province wher...   Nov 24 2005, 09:40 PM
- - scalbers   Thanks Emily for pointing out Bob Pappalardo's...   Nov 24 2005, 10:20 PM
- - deglr6328   Though mainly intended as a refutation of Richard ...   Nov 25 2005, 12:01 AM
|- - Richard Trigaux   QUOTE (deglr6328 @ Nov 25 2005, 12:01 AM)Thou...   Nov 25 2005, 08:12 AM
- - BruceMoomaw   The short version of the "cold low-density up...   Nov 27 2005, 02:32 AM
|- - ljk4-1   Two Large Lakes Discovered Under Antarctic Ice ht...   Jan 26 2006, 06:13 PM
- - Jeff7   Link was truncated. There we go I wonder if ther...   Jan 27 2006, 01:57 AM
|- - Bob Shaw   QUOTE (Jeff7 @ Jan 27 2006, 02:57 AM)Link was...   Jan 27 2006, 06:54 PM
|- - ljk4-1   Newly Discovered Antarctic Lakes http://earthobse...   Feb 8 2006, 12:51 PM
|- - ljk4-1   Special Public Event Europa: Life Beneath the Ice...   Feb 17 2006, 04:23 PM
|- - ljk4-1   THE PITS - Deep Ocean Mining In Prospect http://...   Feb 23 2006, 03:55 PM
- - AlexBlackwell   Today's Planetary Radio podcast (Europa: Life ...   Mar 6 2006, 09:38 PM
- - ljk4-1   Title: Exploring Europa's Ocean: A Challenge ...   Apr 4 2006, 08:17 PM
- - ljk4-1   ERS-2 helps detect massive rivers under Antarctica...   Apr 20 2006, 11:19 AM
|- - Richard Trigaux   What is incredible is that, seemingly, it is the g...   Apr 20 2006, 08:09 PM
- - scalbers   As good a thread as any to post this new paper abo...   Jun 14 2019, 07:35 PM
- - nprev   Reminder to all that this is an older thread (ca. ...   Jun 14 2019, 08:16 PM
- - Tom Tamlyn   QUOTE Double ridge formation over shallow water si...   Apr 19 2022, 10:13 PM


Reply to this topicStart new topic

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 28th March 2024 - 05:47 PM
RULES AND GUIDELINES
Please read the Forum Rules and Guidelines before posting.

IMAGE COPYRIGHT
Images posted on UnmannedSpaceflight.com may be copyrighted. Do not reproduce without permission. Read here for further information on space images and copyright.

OPINIONS AND MODERATION
Opinions expressed on UnmannedSpaceflight.com are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of UnmannedSpaceflight.com or The Planetary Society. The all-volunteer UnmannedSpaceflight.com moderation team is wholly independent of The Planetary Society. The Planetary Society has no influence over decisions made by the UnmannedSpaceflight.com moderators.
SUPPORT THE FORUM
Unmannedspaceflight.com is funded by the Planetary Society. Please consider supporting our work and many other projects by donating to the Society or becoming a member.