IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

The sol 588 and 589 "strange bright lights" [sic], Using the power of UMSF for good
elakdawalla
post Apr 8 2014, 06:57 PM
Post #1


Administrator
****

Group: Admin
Posts: 5172
Joined: 4-August 05
From: Pasadena, CA, USA, Earth
Member No.: 454



In the past, unmannedspaceflight.com has provided a public service to debunk conspiracy claims by helping people locate and describe images related to the weird claim of the week. My favorite two examples of these were the "Sasquatch on Mars" and the "Puddles on Mars." In that spirit, I'm hereby providing links to images and other data related to this week's fun, originating with this Houston Chronicle story: "NASA photo captures strange bright light coming out of Mars", quoting a UFO enthusiast website. Alan Boyle followed up on it with this post that annoyed me, and one just now that has me intrigued, quoting Justin Maki as saying it's not a cosmic ray hit.

Phil Plait asked me about this and I took one look at it and said "cosmic ray hit." Here's the picture, right Navcam from sol 589:

If you compare the image to the left eye taken at exactly the same moment, there is no bright pixel -- this is diagnostic of an event that affected only one camera, so is most likely a cosmic ray hit:

Another thing that tells you it's likely a cosmic ray hit and not a bleeding pixel from something bright is the fact that pixel bleeding on Navcams happens in the horizontal, not vertical direction. Just check any Navcam image of the Sun, or this low-light image from sol 593 in which the sloping side of the RTG is overexposed and bleeding horizontally. By contrast, cosmic ray hits can be oriented in any direction, such as in this nighttime Navcam pic.

And I figured my debunking work was done, until someone pointed out to me that there's another right Navcam image, shot from a similar but not identical location, at the same time of day, pointed in roughly the same direction, that also contains a bright dot. Here's the picture, right Navcam from sol 588:

As with the sol 589 image, the bright dot is not in the Left Navcam frame taken simultaneously, although this time that fact is explained by the presence of a foreground butte blocking the field of view:


This dot is different from the other one. It is not extended vertically. It's just a dot, that overlaps more than one pixel. Still, I would be inclined to dismiss this as a cosmic ray hit (saturating pixels, in one eye and not the other) without extraordinary evidence to the contrary. There are interesting coincidences here that could lend themselves to an alternative explanation, such as a specular reflection from a bright object: both are on the horizon, seen in the same direction, at the same time of day. But there is another coincidence that has me skeptical: seen in right eye only of the Navcam. And the vertical extension of the bright pixel in the sol 589 image just doesn't make sense for a specular glint; that would extend horizontally, not vertically, while cosmic ray hits can make streaks in any direction. So I am still inclined toward cosmic ray hits and coincidence, but I'll admit to being less totally certain about that after seeing the sol 588 image than I was after seeing the sol 589 image alone. And now there's this from engineering camera lead Justin Maki, via Alan Boyle:

QUOTE
"Bright spots appear in single images taken by the Navigation Camera on NASA's Curiosity Mars rover on April 2 and April 3. Each is in an image taken by this stereo camera's right-eye camera [with links to the April 3 and April 2 pictures] but not in images taken within a second of each of those by the left-eye camera [again, with links to April 3 and April 2]. In the two right-eye images, the spot is in different locations of the image frame and, in both cases, at the ground surface level in front of a crater rim on the horizon.

"One possibility is that the light is the glint from a rock surface reflecting the sun. When these images were taken each day, the sun was in the same direction as the bright spot, west-northwest from the rover, and relatively low in the sky. The rover science team is also looking at the possibility that the bright spots could be sunlight reaching the camera's CCD directly through a vent hole in the camera housing, which has happened previously on other cameras on Curiosity and other Mars rovers when the geometry of the incoming sunlight relative to the camera is precisely aligned.

"We think it's either a vent-hole light leak or a glinty rock."


Anybody got anything else to add? Other images of this spot? Where is the spot on the map, exactly? I can (and have) drawn lines on Joe Knapp's map but I'm not convinced I understand the geometry precisely enough to want to say anything about where any putative reflective object would be.


--------------------
My website - My Patreon - @elakdawalla on Twitter - Please support unmannedspaceflight.com by donating here.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Posts in this topic
- elakdawalla   The sol 588 and 589 "strange bright lights" [sic]   Apr 8 2014, 06:57 PM
- - elakdawalla   Also, here are the visualizations from Joe Knapp...   Apr 8 2014, 07:06 PM
- - mhoward   Only thing I have to add: Many people here will re...   Apr 8 2014, 07:26 PM
- - fredk   I noticed the 588 blip at the time since it appear...   Apr 8 2014, 07:45 PM
- - djellison   My very crude take on triangulation from the two N...   Apr 8 2014, 07:52 PM
- - freddo411   Here's another "glint" from the righ...   Apr 8 2014, 08:06 PM
- - djellison   That glint is really nothing like the others in qu...   Apr 8 2014, 08:15 PM
- - ngunn   How simultaneously are the navcam pairs taken? If ...   Apr 8 2014, 08:20 PM
- - djellison   Well - we have one pair where the feature is clear...   Apr 8 2014, 08:27 PM
- - fredk   Here's a stretched, 200% zoom of the two 588 f...   Apr 8 2014, 08:41 PM
- - neorobo   Depending on the smoothness of the surface, specul...   Apr 8 2014, 08:59 PM
- - djellison   I was absolutely 100% "It's a CR hit...   Apr 8 2014, 09:00 PM
|- - fredk   QUOTE (djellison @ Apr 8 2014, 09:00 PM) ...   Apr 8 2014, 09:16 PM
- - mhoward   One 'gleam' of hope for resolving this (ha...   Apr 8 2014, 09:49 PM
- - djellison   The Sol 588 observation ( visible in Right, not in...   Apr 8 2014, 09:54 PM
- - elakdawalla   Where would it be in the sol 593 late afternoon Na...   Apr 8 2014, 11:25 PM
- - djellison   The rock I think we're seeing glinting is also...   Apr 9 2014, 12:18 AM
- - elakdawalla   Boy, would I like to see less-JPEGgy versions of t...   Apr 9 2014, 12:33 AM
|- - PDP8E   QUOTE (elakdawalla @ Apr 8 2014, 07:33 PM...   Apr 9 2014, 12:56 AM
- - fredk   The 589 blip is very clearly a CR. Note that the ...   Apr 9 2014, 12:59 AM
- - atomoid   excellent sleuthing, especially on locating the ca...   Apr 9 2014, 01:01 AM
|- - PDP8E   The glint on sol 588 does not appear to be a CR ...   Apr 9 2014, 03:04 AM
|- - fredk   QUOTE (PDP8E @ Apr 9 2014, 03:04 AM) The ...   Apr 9 2014, 04:01 AM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (fredk @ Apr 8 2014, 09:01 PM) Ther...   Apr 9 2014, 05:20 AM
|- - xflare   QUOTE (fredk @ Apr 9 2014, 05:01 AM) Seri...   Apr 9 2014, 07:39 AM
- - MarsInMyLifetime   What percentage of the cruise stage may have survi...   Apr 9 2014, 02:23 AM
- - DLC   Is it ice? The vertical, light-colored feature see...   Apr 9 2014, 03:36 AM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (DLC @ Apr 8 2014, 07:36 PM) Is it ...   Apr 9 2014, 03:57 AM
- - nprev   Is this (possible) thing anywhere near the planned...   Apr 9 2014, 04:12 AM
- - elakdawalla   No, it's not near the planned path, and no, it...   Apr 9 2014, 04:22 AM
- - nprev   Agree scientifically, of course. Too bad, though; ...   Apr 9 2014, 04:52 AM
|- - vikingmars   QUOTE (nprev @ Apr 9 2014, 06:52 AM) Agre...   Apr 9 2014, 07:26 AM
- - monitorlizard   Something that shiny makes me think of iron-nickel...   Apr 9 2014, 09:21 AM
- - Ant103   I can hardly think it's a reflexion from a dis...   Apr 9 2014, 09:38 AM
- - ngunn   They're shiny [iron meteorites] but rarely hav...   Apr 9 2014, 09:43 AM
|- - ustrax   It's baaack... http://i16.photobucket.com/albu...   Apr 9 2014, 09:48 AM
|- - fredk   QUOTE (ustrax @ Apr 9 2014, 09:48 AM) It...   Apr 9 2014, 02:02 PM
- - jmknapp   Some basic geometry of the situation using SPICE: ...   Apr 9 2014, 11:25 AM
- - Gerald   Do the two lines of sight intersect in 3d space?   Apr 9 2014, 01:12 PM
|- - jmknapp   QUOTE (Gerald @ Apr 9 2014, 08:12 AM) Do ...   Apr 9 2014, 08:10 PM
|- - Gerald   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 9 2014, 09:10 PM) .....   Apr 10 2014, 01:23 PM
|- - DLC   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 9 2014, 04:10 PM) It...   Apr 10 2014, 04:08 PM
|- - jmknapp   QUOTE (DLC @ Apr 10 2014, 12:08 PM) Does ...   Apr 10 2014, 04:45 PM
- - centsworth_II   It seems that the intersection of those two of tho...   Apr 9 2014, 01:25 PM
- - djellison   That triangulation matches, by my estimation, the ...   Apr 9 2014, 01:41 PM
|- - john_s   Tall and thin, indeed. Bright and shiny? Not so ...   Apr 9 2014, 01:59 PM
- - marswiggle   After individually rotating and resizing each of t...   Apr 9 2014, 02:21 PM
- - elakdawalla   I'm still having a hard time thinking of the s...   Apr 9 2014, 03:08 PM
- - marsophile   If the vein was inside a narrow crack between two ...   Apr 9 2014, 03:55 PM
|- - jmknapp   If the sun is 30 degrees above the horizon and the...   Apr 9 2014, 04:02 PM
|- - Thorsten Denk   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 9 2014, 05:02 PM) If...   Apr 9 2014, 08:41 PM
|- - jmknapp   QUOTE (Thorsten Denk @ Apr 9 2014, 03:41 ...   Apr 9 2014, 09:08 PM
|- - Thorsten Denk   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 9 2014, 11:08 PM) I ...   Apr 9 2014, 09:56 PM
- - Gerald   If it's just one surface, yes, but it if it...   Apr 9 2014, 04:23 PM
- - jmknapp   My triangulation could easily be 1 degree off. The...   Apr 9 2014, 06:07 PM
|- - testguru   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 9 2014, 10:07 AM) My...   Apr 9 2014, 07:16 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (testguru @ Apr 9 2014, 11:16 AM) s...   Apr 9 2014, 10:02 PM
- - Phil Stooke   The experience with Spirit was that meteor searche...   Apr 9 2014, 07:47 PM
- - freddo411   I went looking through images hoping to find other...   Apr 9 2014, 09:13 PM
- - atomoid   Heres a crosseye of the candidate rock images post...   Apr 9 2014, 11:33 PM
- - BKing   Looong time lurker un-cloaking to say thanks atomo...   Apr 10 2014, 12:43 AM
- - ronatu   Could it be gas eruption? Dust diavol?   Apr 10 2014, 02:49 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (ronatu @ Apr 10 2014, 06:49 AM) Du...   Apr 10 2014, 03:34 PM
- - Ant103   Impossible : it should have been saw by all the Na...   Apr 10 2014, 03:06 PM
- - Gerald   If it's a "real" object, there are q...   Apr 10 2014, 03:54 PM
- - Gerald   I'd say, if the different position of the brig...   Apr 10 2014, 04:52 PM
- - vikingmars   This "strange bright light" event is now...   Apr 10 2014, 08:25 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (vikingmars @ Apr 10 2014, 12:25 PM...   Apr 10 2014, 09:24 PM
- - anticitizen2   No way, there's going to be something weird in...   Apr 10 2014, 08:31 PM
- - elakdawalla   What anticitizen2 said. The robot is on Mars to do...   Apr 10 2014, 08:38 PM
- - algorithm   If I were the NASA chap in charge of persuading th...   Apr 10 2014, 08:46 PM
- - MarsInMyLifetime   I hope this applies to your guideline, Emily. I f...   Apr 10 2014, 08:59 PM
- - ngunn   Just a stray thought because I've not seen it ...   Apr 10 2014, 09:33 PM
- - Gerald   A NavCam image FOV is about 45°, and 1024 pixels w...   Apr 10 2014, 11:22 PM
- - jmknapp   Another example of a bright spot in NRB but not NL...   Apr 11 2014, 12:43 AM
|- - elakdawalla   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 10 2014, 05:43 PM) A...   Apr 11 2014, 01:03 AM
||- - jmknapp   QUOTE (elakdawalla @ Apr 10 2014, 08:03 P...   Apr 11 2014, 08:40 AM
||- - CzarnyZajaczek   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 11 2014, 10:40 AM) M...   Apr 14 2014, 04:08 PM
||- - jmknapp   QUOTE (CzarnyZajaczek @ Apr 14 2014, 11:0...   Apr 14 2014, 06:36 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 10 2014, 05:43 PM) I...   Apr 11 2014, 03:56 AM
- - JohnVV   a good article that pretty much puts this to rest ...   Apr 11 2014, 12:52 AM
- - elakdawalla   Ha, he wrote that article after asking me about it...   Apr 11 2014, 01:01 AM
- - atomoid   indeed, and to think I spent probably an hour frui...   Apr 11 2014, 01:44 AM
- - ngunn   Brilliant work. Hats off!!   Apr 11 2014, 09:02 AM
- - Gerald   The bearing is to the east, a very different angle...   Apr 11 2014, 09:11 AM
|- - jmknapp   QUOTE (Gerald @ Apr 11 2014, 05:11 AM) Th...   Apr 11 2014, 07:46 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 11 2014, 12:46 PM) I...   Apr 11 2014, 07:55 PM
|- - jmknapp   QUOTE (djellison @ Apr 11 2014, 03:55 PM)...   Apr 11 2014, 08:45 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (jmknapp @ Apr 11 2014, 12:45 PM) W...   Apr 11 2014, 09:18 PM
- - nprev   Agreed. The nine-day wonder effect is extremely li...   Apr 11 2014, 08:44 PM
- - ngunn   I don't undertand why there's so much atte...   Apr 11 2014, 09:57 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (ngunn @ Apr 11 2014, 01:57 PM) why...   Apr 11 2014, 11:34 PM
- - Gerald   At the moment we can just persue a couple of hypot...   Apr 11 2014, 11:06 PM
- - Gerald   That's a small region of the JunoCam EFB17 ima...   Apr 14 2014, 11:27 PM
|- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Gerald @ Apr 14 2014, 04:27 PM) In...   Apr 15 2014, 12:08 AM
|- - Gerald   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Apr 15 2014, 01:08 AM...   Apr 15 2014, 01:22 AM
||- - mcaplinger   QUOTE (Gerald @ Apr 14 2014, 06:22 PM) Do...   Apr 15 2014, 03:10 AM
|- - elakdawalla   QUOTE (mcaplinger @ Apr 14 2014, 04:08 PM...   Apr 15 2014, 01:50 AM
- - algorithm   I was looking at post#25 from gerald and did a sim...   Apr 18 2014, 09:46 PM
2 Pages V   1 2 >


Reply to this topicStart new topic

 



RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 19th April 2024 - 09:23 PM
RULES AND GUIDELINES
Please read the Forum Rules and Guidelines before posting.

IMAGE COPYRIGHT
Images posted on UnmannedSpaceflight.com may be copyrighted. Do not reproduce without permission. Read here for further information on space images and copyright.

OPINIONS AND MODERATION
Opinions expressed on UnmannedSpaceflight.com are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of UnmannedSpaceflight.com or The Planetary Society. The all-volunteer UnmannedSpaceflight.com moderation team is wholly independent of The Planetary Society. The Planetary Society has no influence over decisions made by the UnmannedSpaceflight.com moderators.
SUPPORT THE FORUM
Unmannedspaceflight.com is funded by the Planetary Society. Please consider supporting our work and many other projects by donating to the Society or becoming a member.