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"Aernus", A proposed new planet in the Kuiper Belt
ustrax
post Oct 11 2007, 08:40 AM
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Tomorrow at DPS Patryk Lykawka will make a presentation where he points out to the existence of a planet with the diameter of the Earth at 100AU.

I received his answers regarding the work done yesterday, here's some of it (the rest is you know where...):

"This massive planetesimal would be, now, at this moment in the history of the Solar System, orbiting the Sun at a distance of, at least, 100 AU, or, simplifying, 3 to 4 times more distant from our star than Pluto.
A far, massive, transplutonian planet in the Lykawka’s description who remarks the importance that the orbital evolution of this planet may be the key to answer several unexplained enigmas of the Kuiper Belt, among which he points out a few…:
The excitation actually observed in the region between 40 and 50 AU is one, another are the populations of different types of objects in the Belt and their orbital characteristics.
Another two pieces of the puzzle can also be put into place under Patrik work: the Belt’s truncated region in the 48 AU region and its small total mass."

What's your opinion regarding this?...
According to him this is not like Planet X, his study even erases Planet X from the map...

EDITED: "Aernus" is the name I'm using, it was the divinity of the Zoelae, a pre-historic tribe that lived in the most remote corner of my country...


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ngunn
post Oct 11 2007, 09:14 AM
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Interesting. A massive distant planet is one way to account for the orbit of Sedna. I don't know if one Earth mass is enough though.
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ustrax
post Oct 11 2007, 09:20 AM
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QUOTE (ngunn @ Oct 11 2007, 10:14 AM) *
Interesting. A massive distant planet is one way to account for the orbit of Sedna. I don't know if one Earth mass is enough though.


The same diameter but tenths of Earth mass if I understood correctly... wink.gif


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nprev
post Oct 11 2007, 09:36 AM
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<sigh>. I knew this would happen...time to contact the SIRTF folks & try to get some allocated observation time. Gonna be tough, even if the damn thing's really there.

Just to clarify: I personally expect that there's at least one Mars-sized body or better in loose orbit around the Sun out to a half light-year or so. I wouldn't be surprised if there are more than that, nor would discovery of a gas-giant-class object at far greater distances be beyond the pale.

In addition to dynamical effects on the Kuiper Belt, the presence or absence of such objects might tell us a great deal about the history of the Solar System, at least from the viewpoint of how often or recently the Sun has passed near other stars. Hell, come to that, something out there might well be a capture, particularly if it's in an eccentric orbit...


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ustrax
post Oct 11 2007, 11:09 AM
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QUOTE (nprev @ Oct 11 2007, 10:36 AM) *
Just to clarify: I personally expect that there's at least one Mars-sized body or better in loose orbit around the Sun out to a half light-year or so. I wouldn't be surprised if there are more than that, nor would discovery of a gas-giant-class object at far greater distances be beyond the pale.


Sounds plausible to me, but I am really curious to know how will be reactions to the presentation...

Time for a Kuyper Belt grand tour mission...
What a crop of planets that would be! wink.gif


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belleraphon1
post Oct 11 2007, 01:08 PM
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ustrax and all...

regarding Aernus' composition......

according to the following reference work...

"MASS-RADIUS RELATIONSHIPS FOR SOLID EXOPLANETS
S. Seager, M. Kuchner, C. A. Hier-Majumder, B. Militzer4
http://fr.arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0707/0707.2895v1.pdf

Using the graph on page 21, "Mass-radius relationship for solid planets" it is indeed theorectically possible to have a one Earth radius planet but just .3 Earth mass if the composition is rocky with a lot of ices.

Very Cool!!!!!

Craig
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ustrax
post Oct 11 2007, 01:32 PM
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QUOTE (belleraphon1 @ Oct 11 2007, 02:08 PM) *
Very Cool!!!!!


Very cool is also Lykawka's sound, I've heard some and like a few, e.g. "Mankind Roots"... cool.gif


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alan
post Oct 11 2007, 04:26 PM
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QUOTE (ustrax @ Oct 11 2007, 03:40 AM) *
Tomorrow at DPS Patryk Lykawka will make a presentation where he points out to the existence of a planet with the diameter of the Earth at 100AU....

...Another two pieces of the puzzle can also be put into place under Patrik work: the Belt’s truncated region in the 48 AU region and its small total mass."

does this mean it has cleared its neighborhood?

ducks and runs
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Alan Stern
post Oct 11 2007, 04:39 PM
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QUOTE (ustrax @ Oct 11 2007, 11:09 AM) *
Sounds plausible to me, but I am really curious to know how will be reactions to the presentation...

Time for a Kuyper Belt grand tour mission...
What a crop of planets that would be! wink.gif



Of course, none are planets, even Earth-sized-- says the IAU. Good thing they have no police force, since so few are following their "law".
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David
post Oct 11 2007, 08:26 PM
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QUOTE (Alan Stern @ Oct 11 2007, 04:39 PM) *
Of course, none are planets, even Earth-sized-- says the IAU. Good thing they have no police force, since so few are following their "law".


Your job title: Planetary Police Officer
Your employer: The International Astronomical Union
Your task: Scour the fringes of the Solar System, and break up excessively large planets before they can pose a threat to astronomical law and order.

The fate of the planetary regulatory regime depends on you!

Applicants for this position are welcome from any planet. Plutonians need not apply.
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tuvas
post Oct 12 2007, 01:36 PM
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QUOTE (alan @ Oct 11 2007, 09:26 AM) *
does this mean it has cleared its neighborhood?

ducks and runs


I would guess that yes, although Sedna might be a problem... Hmmm... Still, it would take a long time to prove it...
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Greg Hullender
post Oct 12 2007, 04:46 PM
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So was the presentation given? Is it available online now? Was it well-received?

If "Aernus" fails to qualify as a planet, I'm afraid the likeliest reason won't be failure to clear its orbit -- it'll be failure to be in orbit in the first place. I'll be particularly interested to see if the paper gives a clear suggestion as to where to look for this thing.

--Greg
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ustrax
post Oct 12 2007, 04:57 PM
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QUOTE (Greg Hullender @ Oct 12 2007, 05:46 PM) *
So was the presentation given? Is it available online now? Was it well-received?


I can't answer you that but I'm waiting for Lykawka contact regarding the post-presentation...
Maybe during the weekend as he must be returning to Japan, but Emily told me she had someone covering it...let's wait...

Now the sun shines, it is friday...I'll go surf for an hour or two...Good weekend to you all! wink.gif


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ustrax
post Oct 13 2007, 01:45 PM
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Here's a quick update, Lykawka sounded a bit sad for the short minutes he had to present his work...maybe from here on things will improve... wink.gif


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nprev
post Oct 14 2007, 02:11 AM
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Damn...those are by far the tightest time constraints I've ever seen for a presentation!!! blink.gif

Actually, though, that's a good thing...seen too many meetings descend into chaos because of open time limits (some people, usually in the audience, apparently think that they are paid by the word...) This method keeps the focus tight, tends to minimize grand-standing and B.S.

Best of all, this idea is resonating in the heads of the attendees, some of whom will pursue the concept independently and contact Lykawka for productive one-on-one discussion. I don't think he should feel sad at all; it sounds like a resounding success! smile.gif


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