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Mercury Landers
gndonald
post Aug 15 2005, 03:36 PM
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While the likelyhood of a Mercury Lander mission is very low, I was wondering if any planning/studies have been done on such a project?
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tasp
post Nov 26 2005, 06:14 PM
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Just throwing out some ideas, may be helpful in the long run.

The amazing trajectory Messenger is taking to Mercury would be reversible, wouldn't it? I'm thinking an orbiter/lander could be sent to Mercury (granted this part is going to be heavy) to study the planet, and the lander could collect some surface samples and put them into orbit around Mercury.

A retreiver craft could be sent to collect the samples and then return to earth via a reversed version of the Messenger flight plan.

The key to making this work is that you set it up so that as much of the delta v as possible is provided by gravity assists from Earth, Venus, and Mercury for all the spacecraft involved in the mission.



Also,

To expand on some of the ideas posted in this thread, could a kevlar net orbiting Mercury (tethered to a shielded orbiter) 'snag' debris from a plume generated from an impactor craft?

This might be a 'cheap and dirty' way of retrieving materials from the surface of Mercury as part of mission to return them to earth.
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Bob Shaw
post Nov 26 2005, 06:30 PM
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QUOTE (tasp @ Nov 26 2005, 07:14 PM)
Just throwing out some ideas, may be helpful in the long run.

The amazing trajectory Messenger is taking to Mercury would be reversible, wouldn't it?  I'm thinking an orbiter/lander could be sent to Mercury (granted this part is going to be heavy) to study the planet, and the lander could collect some surface samples and put them into orbit around Mercury. 

A retreiver craft could be sent to collect the samples and then return to earth via a reversed version of the Messenger flight plan.

The key to making this work is that you set it  up so that as much of the delta v as possible is provided by gravity assists from Earth, Venus, and Mercury for all the spacecraft involved in the mission.
Also,

To expand on some of the ideas posted in this thread, could a kevlar net orbiting Mercury (tethered to a shielded orbiter) 'snag' debris from a plume generated from an impactor craft?

This might be a 'cheap and dirty' way of retrieving materials from the surface of Mercury as part of mission to return them to earth.
*




The killer with Mercury landings - not counting the interplanetary stuff, where perhaps there might be *reverse* slingshots to be had with some clever planning - is that as it's an airless body you're limited to rocket-based descents. Add the cost of transporting your fuel for ascent and there are some quite rapid diminishing returns! Of course, if there's ice at the poles, in-situ fuel might be an option - otherwise, the 'smash and grab' mission seems about the only game in town!

Bob Shaw


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tty
post Nov 27 2005, 04:42 PM
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QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Nov 26 2005, 08:30 PM)
The killer with Mercury landings - not counting the interplanetary stuff, where perhaps there might be *reverse* slingshots to be had with some clever planning - is that as it's an airless body you're limited to rocket-based descents. Add the cost of transporting your fuel for ascent and there are some quite rapid diminishing returns!  Of course, if there's ice at the poles, in-situ fuel might be an option - otherwise, the 'smash and grab' mission seems about the only game in town!

Bob Shaw
*


The best and fastest way to acquire Mercury samples is almost certainly to search for meteorites here on Earth.
I'm reminded of an old saying in paleontological circles: "The best place to find unknown fossil species is in museum drawers". smile.gif

tty
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DEChengst
post Nov 27 2005, 09:20 PM
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QUOTE (tty @ Nov 27 2005, 05:42 PM)
The best and fastest way to acquire Mercury samples is almost certainly to search for meteorites here on Earth.
*


But that wouldn't be as interesting. The great thing about a sample return mission is that you can select the rocks that you'll be researching. There are a lot of Martian meteorites, but we would learn at lot more if we could get our hands on some Meridiani Planum sedimentary rocks.


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Posts in this topic
- gndonald   Mercury Landers   Aug 15 2005, 03:36 PM
- - Patteroast   The European 'BepiColumbo' mission planned...   Aug 15 2005, 04:13 PM
|- - Bob Shaw   QUOTE (Patteroast @ Aug 15 2005, 05:13 PM)The...   Aug 15 2005, 07:05 PM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Aug 15 2005, 12:05 PM)The p...   Aug 16 2005, 03:55 PM
- - djellison   Impactor could work Doug   Aug 15 2005, 07:24 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   ESA studied alternative possible designs for a Bep...   Aug 15 2005, 07:30 PM
- - remcook   Although the Bepi-Colombo lander is cancelled, ESA...   Aug 16 2005, 08:44 AM
- - djellison   Well - studies dont equal flight hardware. Maybe ...   Aug 16 2005, 08:57 AM
- - remcook   actually, hardware is actually made at this moment...   Aug 16 2005, 03:01 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   (1) That Mercury smash-and-grab mission is a real...   Aug 16 2005, 07:53 PM
|- - DDAVIS   [quote=BruceMoomaw,Aug 16 2005, 07:53 PM] (2) Ac...   Aug 16 2005, 10:30 PM
|- - JRehling   Not to be a party-pooper, but the degree of spec...   Aug 17 2005, 06:44 AM
- - djellison   Well quite - of the planets on which one COULD lan...   Aug 16 2005, 10:46 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   You're forgetting 2003 UB313, Doug... (Or, alt...   Aug 17 2005, 12:57 AM
|- - um3k   QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Aug 16 2005, 08:57 PM)Yo...   Aug 17 2005, 01:06 AM
- - Richard Trigaux   JRehling, your smash and grab idea is interesting....   Aug 17 2005, 06:11 AM
- - edstrick   JRehling observed " We probably have, or will...   Aug 17 2005, 10:59 AM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (edstrick @ Aug 17 2005, 03:59 AM)JRehl...   Aug 17 2005, 04:02 PM
|- - Stephen   QUOTE (edstrick @ Aug 17 2005, 10:59 AM)Where...   Sep 1 2005, 02:36 AM
- - Richard Trigaux   What is astonishing with Mercury is that it closel...   Aug 17 2005, 12:29 PM
- - centsworth_II   If getting a refector on Mercury is the objective,...   Aug 17 2005, 04:44 PM
- - tty   Here is a recent study of the probability of findi...   Aug 17 2005, 05:48 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   We don't want a reflector on Mercury for libra...   Aug 17 2005, 10:12 PM
- - Myran   Cant but agree with BruceMoomaw, libration studies...   Aug 18 2005, 05:55 AM
- - Richard Trigaux   centsworth_II your idea is interesting, but it wou...   Aug 18 2005, 06:40 AM
- - BruceMoomaw   I honestly don't know why they had it in mind,...   Aug 19 2005, 06:40 AM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Aug 18 2005, 11:40 PM)I ...   Aug 19 2005, 01:54 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   Well, I know that, John. I presumed that Richard ...   Aug 19 2005, 06:23 PM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Aug 19 2005, 11:23 AM)We...   Aug 19 2005, 09:31 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   ESA was thinking about a lander only 3 degrees fro...   Sep 1 2005, 03:01 AM
- - tasp   Just throwing out some ideas, may be helpful in th...   Nov 26 2005, 06:14 PM
|- - Bob Shaw   QUOTE (tasp @ Nov 26 2005, 07:14 PM)Just thro...   Nov 26 2005, 06:30 PM
|- - tty   QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Nov 26 2005, 08:30 PM)The k...   Nov 27 2005, 04:42 PM
|- - DEChengst   QUOTE (tty @ Nov 27 2005, 05:42 PM)The best a...   Nov 27 2005, 09:20 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   There was, I've heard (though I haven't co...   Nov 26 2005, 09:13 PM
- - edstrick   Two or three years ago, there was some reporting o...   Nov 27 2005, 08:43 PM
|- - JRehling   I can't find the reference to the Mercury smas...   Nov 28 2005, 01:55 AM
- - BruceMoomaw   Keep in mind that this thing will fly past Mercury...   Nov 28 2005, 02:11 AM
- - ljk4-1   In this 1971 book, Beyond the Moon: Future Explora...   May 30 2006, 06:15 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   NASA never -- and I mean never -- put any Mercury ...   May 31 2006, 05:45 AM


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