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Posted by: nprev Jul 31 2012, 12:59 PM

It's gettin' near that time.

Please post all comments regarding the last portion of Curiosity's voyage to Gale Crater here; thanks!

Posted by: pospa Jul 31 2012, 05:09 PM

With all respect, nprev, isn't it a bit premature to close "MSL Aproach Phase" thread and leave just MSL EDL open?
MSL is still in the Final Approach phase, with one or maybe two TCMs still scheduled before EDL which starts by reaching the top of the Martian atmosphere....

ADMIN NOTE: After some discussion on the matter, the thread is open again. However, even MSL is in EDL-mode now

Posted by: RoverDriver Jul 31 2012, 05:25 PM

We can always begin a new thread and call it the 132 hours of terror ;-)

Paolo

Posted by: pospa Jul 31 2012, 06:02 PM

Good solution, Paolo
... but, can someone withstand so many hours of terror?

Posted by: MarsEngineer Jul 31 2012, 07:00 PM

Technically we are in that fuzzy zone where late cruise (approach phase) and EDL overlap. We MAY be in a place where we are done targeting and done with the cruise propulsion. We will see. It is looking pretty good.

We are now focussed on getting our security access badges.

The clock is ticking.

-Rob

Posted by: Gsnorgathon Jul 31 2012, 07:11 PM

Somehow, "132 hours of growing apprehension" doesn't really sing, does it?

Posted by: diane Jul 31 2012, 07:33 PM

132 hours of galloping ADD?

Posted by: Drkskywxlt Jul 31 2012, 08:05 PM

131 hours of finger-tapping impatience, 53 minutes of hair-pulling clock-watching, 7 minutes of terror and 2 years of fun!

Posted by: MahFL Jul 31 2012, 08:56 PM

Is there going to be another press conference before landing ?

Posted by: dmg Jul 31 2012, 09:09 PM

See Emily Lakdawalla's summary of the planned press conferences:

http://www.planetary.org/blogs/emily-lakdawalla/2012/07302015-curiosity-press-schedule.html

DG

Posted by: Oersted Jul 31 2012, 11:07 PM

I suspect nprev is in the pockets of the peanut grower's lobby... ;-)

Posted by: Burmese Jul 31 2012, 11:34 PM

Perhaps someone could use this point to summarize for everyone what communication signals will be possible from MSL, as it moves into EDL before blackout etc... so everyone will know the sequence and timing to expect (or hope for).


Also, as to whether it is too early or not for this thread, I just saw the following tweet from Curiosity:

Curiosity Rover ‏@MarsCuriosity

Timeline activated. Bleep-bop. I'm running entry, descent & landing flight software all on my own. Countdown to Mars: 5 days

Posted by: RoverDriver Aug 1 2012, 12:46 AM

Question: is it critical that the peanuts be Planters? Do they need to be in a sealed amerstat envelope? Is there a throughput range of peanuts/hour that needs to be maintained? Is 10% margin enough?
I only have a 124.75 hours left for V&V!

Paolo

Posted by: nprev Aug 1 2012, 02:55 AM

I strongly urge all to run out and purchase many kilograms of "nprev" brand peanuts.

Yes, Nprev Brand EDL Peanuts!!! The shiny metal treat that TELLS you to bite it!!!

Seriously, though, as Burmese pointed out, we're definitely in the endgame now. Buckle up; it's gonna be quite a ride!!!

Posted by: RoverDriver Aug 1 2012, 04:52 AM

I bought mine from the TJ's in La Canada, next to JPL, they have a painting of MER (and Phoenix I think) on their walls. I guess their stuff is flight-qualified.

Paolo

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 1 2012, 04:52 AM

Just to confirm: it is still a go for HiRISE to snap a pic? I didn't hear anything recently, so I'm assuming its not cancelled.

Posted by: RoverDriver Aug 1 2012, 05:51 AM

I heard there's 60% probability of successfully capturing MSL during (E)DL.

Paolo

Posted by: climber Aug 1 2012, 10:40 AM

Mars as seen from the spacecraft is now about half the size of our Moon as seen from Earth.

Posted by: Oersted Aug 1 2012, 03:47 PM

Thanks for that very telling factoid climber: good for visualizing the speed and distance involved.

Posted by: climber Aug 1 2012, 08:30 PM

Yes, it's what I like to imagine since Mariner 9 a long long time ago! Kms or miles to go mean a lot more if you can see with your own eyes what they represent. This is very different when a spacecraft nears (no pun intended) Jupiter or Vesta.

Posted by: brellis Aug 2 2012, 12:35 AM

During the final stage of descent, can a gust of wind start MSL spinning and get the Skycrane cables all twisted up? Would that create a problem with releasing MSL upon landing?

Posted by: nprev Aug 2 2012, 12:56 AM

Without knowing the details, the fact that we've succesfully landed six spacecraft on Mars using AFAIK pretty much the same sort of parachute schema (the terminal phases of EDL obviously differ for each spacecraft type & method) strongly implies that this problem has been solved.

Posted by: MarsEngineer Aug 2 2012, 01:31 AM

Even a very high speed gust of wind produces a very small force in the low density Mars atmosphere. Remember the force of wind or the dynamic pressure per unit area = 1/2 rho v^2 where rho is the density of the atmosphere and v is the velocity. Mars' density is about 1/100th of earth so in order to "feel" the same force you would get on Earth with a 10 mph breeze, on Mars you would need the velocity of the wind to be 10 times faster (10^2 = 100) on Mars than on Earth. So a 100 mph wind on Mars "feels" like a 10 mph breeze on earth (not counting the sting of entrained dust slamming into your skin at 100 mpg .

In addition we simulated what would happen with a very high speed wind gust while in the skycrane phase and we found that the controller on the descent stage is very responsive. Much as you would be if you were to hold a suspended weight by your fingers. Try this: hang a weight and from a 2 foot string with your hand. Have someone swing it. Now see how fast you can damp the motion by moving your hand with the swinging motion. You will be amazing at how quickly you can stop the swinging. Now do in with your eyes shut. Same.

-Rob Manning
MSL Chief Engineer

PS I am totally focussed on surface now. We are looking really good for Sunday night! ( Knock on wood and pass the peanuts .. then the tums.)
I will be doing a little talking on NASA TV just before landing. If I say anything silly or in error, sorry! You all seem to know more about MSL than normal humans and perhaps even me! (although I try to keep up with you all.) This will be my 5th Mars landing. It never seems to get old.

Posted by: djellison Aug 2 2012, 05:06 AM

And so will I - but much earlier than Rob. I'll be on at about 8.50pm local time during the educational pre-show to talk about Eyes on the Solar System and the AR App. Infact, my colleague Jon and I will be sat about 6 feet behind Gay, the presenter of the EDL broadcast, on Sunday night. Rob - I promise not to heckle. :-)

And - tomorrow morning ( at 10am and 11am local ) there is a Science, and an Engineering pre-landing conference. Both should be worth watching.... usual links apply - www.nasa.gov/ntv or www.ustream.tv/nasajpl or /nasajpl2

Posted by: SpaceListener Aug 2 2012, 06:06 AM

According to the publish book: MSLanding, Mars at Glance, the Surface winds at the surface would be between 0 to 32kph, with gust of about 144kph. However the Sky crane will be deselarating and lowering very slow starting from 1.6km from the surface and continue descending at 2.7 kph (walking very slow) and it will release the Curiosity when Sky Crane is hovering at about 20 meters from surface. Besides, at this height, Sky crane must have a very good control of stability before releasing the Curiosity. Its descending will take about 27 seconds (0.75 m/sec). On the other hand, if at this moment there is wind, its wind is so light (1/100 density of Earth's) and the Curiosity is weighing about 341 kg at Martian gravity, then the wind push on Curiosity will be very small. I hope that the lowering controls have greater advantages to control against the spinning and twisting.

Posted by: brellis Aug 2 2012, 06:21 AM

Rob Manning suggested:

I tried this, with my cat as the "someone" to swing it. You're right! It even works with my eyes shut!

edit: the 'spin' factor was not helped by my steadying hand, just the swinging back and forth, to and fro. I hope there aren't any giant cats waiting in Gale Crater!

Posted by: climber Aug 2 2012, 08:43 AM

I'm pretty sure DAN will show us very soon here what a Catcrane manoeuver would look like

Posted by: climber Aug 2 2012, 11:04 AM

To give a rought idea of what is coming up and when (mind, time is approximate and all PST)


Date : August 5th 07h30 am PST / August 4th 16h30 PST / August 3rd 10h30 am PST
Distance to Mars (km) : 192 000 / 384 000 / 768 000
Mars diameter (°) : 2 / 1 / 0,5
Equivalent : Earth seen from the Moon** / Earth-Moon distance / Moon seen from Earth


**: for the happy few that have seen with their own eyes what that really means

Posted by: Oersted Aug 2 2012, 11:11 PM

Been following your landings since Pathfinder/Sojourner... You've come a long way! - I presume the tension is still almost unbearable, but has the emotional experience changed in any way? More cerebral? Better able to "observe yourself"? Enjoying the moment more?

You have got multitudes rooting for you and backing you all over this good Earth!

Posted by: ChrisC Aug 3 2012, 03:27 AM

Did this thread go through another delete / restore cycle again today? I had it loaded up on my mobile device yesterday, to start monitoring for the weekend's approach, but when I went to reload it this morning to get the latest, it 404'd on me. I navigated upside down and sideways and the thread simply did not exist anymore. Now it's back. Huh?

Anyway, glad to have it. Thanks, and back to lurking!

Posted by: elakdawalla Aug 3 2012, 03:35 AM

As far as I understand it, the spin of the S/C under parachute (so-called "wrist mode") is actively damped by thrusters.

ChrisC: There were a few hours' downtime today that shouldn't be repeated due to an IP address swap or something or other.

Posted by: nprev Aug 3 2012, 03:37 AM

Almost certainly http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7389&hl=. It's in the extremely talented hands of one of our Admins.

Posted by: Oersted Aug 3 2012, 03:05 PM

Yes, that is correct. It's described in a section of this (rather hard to find) paper by Steltzner et al:

Mars Science Laboratory Entry, Descent, and Landing System Overview
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CEgQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.nasaspaceflight.com%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D27414.0%3Battach%3D342152&ei=j-cbUOWvEIfOhAfynoGgAg&usg=AFQjCNFKEo8DDzyBgNBcpdnJsZGq91vK3w

P.8: Wrist Mode Damping
Estimating the oscillatory behavior of an entry capsule suspended underneath a parachute is an extremely dynamic and complex problem. Initial conditions at parachute deployment can pump large energies into the capsule wrist mode (rotation underneath the parachute about the capsule center of gravity) which will decay with time. Historical attempts to bound the wrist mode behavior and its time evolution following parachute deployment have failed to bound the behavior observed during flight (e.g. MER-B ).
While the MSL team believes we have attained a deeper understanding of wrist mode dynamics and the energies involved, the sensitivity of subsequent EDL events to high wrist mode energies led to the inclusion of an active wrist mode damping mechanism using the RCS thrusters. In cases where the capsule wrist mode frequency violates the “safe” flight envelope, RCS thrusters will fire to reduce the wrist mode frequency to acceptable levels.
Wrist mode damping is active throughout parachute descent and ensures a safe heatshield separation, good TDS surface acquisition, and a safe backshell separation.

Posted by: Phil Stooke Aug 3 2012, 05:14 PM

It's happening again in the run up to MSL... journalists pontificating about the percentage of Mars probe failures.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/2/3215863/mars-missions-failed

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/08/failure-to-reach-mars/



I thought a look at the data might help. I listed missions by country of origin and success or failure, allowing a partial success category as well. But even doing this gets complicated. I have listed Mars Express and Beagle 2 as separate because it seems unfair to categorize Mars Express as a partial success. I put Mars Polar Lander and Deep Space 2 as separate, for no very good reason. So should all the components of Mars 96 be listed separately? Is Viking two successes or four? And to be more realistic Mars 2 should be counted as a total failure.

Even so, you can see that most failures are Soviet, most successes American. Most failures are early, most successes recent. Most journalist claims are literally true but misleading to make a good story. The worst point is the one about 30 percent of landers succeeding. Six out of seven US landers worked, so to get the 30 percent success rate you have to count every separate lander on every Soviet mission, including launch failures where the lander was never put to the test.


Phil

Posted by: RoverDriver Aug 3 2012, 06:50 PM

One thing they don't understand is that we have something nobody else has: ROB MANNING!!!

Paolo

Posted by: Hungry4info Aug 4 2012, 12:18 AM

From MSL, Mars is now 0.561° in angular diameter -- larger than the Moon from Earth (0.507° average).

Posted by: B Bernatchez Aug 4 2012, 02:24 AM

Are we there yet?

Posted by: RoverDriver Aug 4 2012, 03:35 AM

Yes we are. Start packing your toys and stuff, we are almost home.

Paolo

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 4 2012, 04:23 AM

Present your E-tickets tickets to the lady at the turnstile. Fasten your seat-belts and stand clear of the closing doors. It is important to secure all loose objects, and please keep hands and arms inside at all times.

Posted by: John Copella Aug 4 2012, 04:54 AM

So, no L-2 TCM, I'm assuming? (saw no news of it, but maybe I missed it)

Posted by: RoverDriver Aug 4 2012, 05:00 AM

You forgot the turret as well. Sorry, couldn't resist.



Apparently they are so dead on that they don't need to do any corrections.

Paolo

Posted by: Deimos Aug 4 2012, 11:24 AM

Blame is at least in part misdirected -- that narrative is coming out of NASA HQ. Reporters doing this, I can at least understand. And NASA making sure people understand there are risks, I can understand. Jim Green pushing the 40% story--that seems like a disservice. Christian Science Monitor was working on a story -- the reporter seemed to be calling BS on that narrative.

Posted by: jmknapp Aug 4 2012, 05:29 PM

In the press conference going on right now, a reporter tried to pin the panel down on the estimate of the odds, but no one bit. Doug McCuistion, director of the Mars program, essentially said there were too many variables and no way to put a meaningful number on it, and Richard Cook, flight operations manager, said that they've done lots of Monte Carlo simulations of what might happen during EDL, but always assuming that the hardware works.

Since NASA was able to come up with risk assessments for the Shuttle (what was it, something like 1 in 100?), not sure why a ballpark number couldn't be put on this one.

Posted by: mcaplinger Aug 4 2012, 06:16 PM

IMHO, such figures for complex systems that aren't tested a statistically-meaningful number of times are essentially meaningless. IIRC estimates of shuttle reliability before Challenger varied by several orders of magnitude; the 1:100 was just the one that turned out to be right.

Also, consider that many failures could be caused by bad software.

Posted by: diane Aug 4 2012, 07:32 PM

Since software reliability is something I do know about...

Limiting reliability assessments to either 1 or 0 is absurd; in such a case, the reliability must be assumed 0. Complex software systems will not be defect-free. The appropriate questions are whether sufficient testing has been done, whether defects are encountered during a particular operation (EDL, for example), whether the defect causes significant problems, whether there is sufficient error detection and recovery in place, whether redundancies are in place, whether failover mechanisms are in place (and function correctly), whether a failure in one module can affect correct operation of other modules, etc.

I used to work on programming for public telephone switching systems. The watch-phrase was "belt and suspenders" - always have a backup system in place and ready to take over immediately.

I trust that the MSL software engineers have done their work well, and I look forward to great celebrations on Monday.

Posted by: mcaplinger Aug 4 2012, 07:57 PM

I'd like to think I do too; among other things I wrote most of the flight software in the science cameras for MSL (Mastcam/MAHLI/MARDI.)

The quote was from an article in the Communications of the ACM, a leading computer science journal.

At any rate, all I was suggesting is that quantifying the likelihood of encountering a software bug is potentially meaningless. Obviously we have had many successful runs of the EDL sequence and all known bugs have been dealt with.

Posted by: MahFL Aug 4 2012, 08:08 PM

From a layman, the main thing is it's designed to be successful, so barring a mistake, bad luck or hardware fault, it should all work just fine !

Posted by: diane Aug 4 2012, 09:12 PM

Writing flight software for any part of MSL sounds like an enormously fun and challenging job. I'm looking forward to seeing years of photos from your software!

As far as the CACM quote, it really felt like it was dodging the issue and taking a rather fatalistic attitude. (It's also from 1990; the same author might have an entirely different viewpoint today.) There are metrics, starting with code coverage, test cases run, etc. Part of the quality assessment is historical, from either operational use or from simulations, as you mention. Part of the assessment is qualitative, too, from activities such as code and test plan inspections, etc. Reducing it to "1 or 0" is like saying that either we'll all be happy after EDL, or not. It says nothing about the hard work, creativity, or ingenuity required to maximize the probability of success.

Some measures of quality have to be approached statistically. On the telephone system, I worked in billing; we had two requirements in particular: no more than 10,000 billing records lost in any outage, and no more than 1 record lost or in error out of every 100,000 records. Since billing records tend to be lost (or worse, duplicated) in blocks of 80 or so, and usually with multiple buffers or files involved, there's no real way to measure, and the statistical arguments then go to "over what time period", "across how many systems", etc. Given enough trials, the probability of error approaches certainty, but that says nothing at all about the probability of error in any single trial. Measures such as reliability, availability, and fault tolerance are really not "pass/fail" assessments.

Posted by: algorimancer Aug 4 2012, 09:30 PM

Just to be safe, when I see the landing time listed as 10:31 pm (Pacific time) tomorrow, is that the time on Mars or when we see the signal here?

Posted by: jmknapp Aug 4 2012, 09:33 PM

That's earth-received time, plus or minus a minute or so due to weather & other uncertainties, according to today's press conference.

Posted by: MahFL Aug 4 2012, 09:47 PM

They will have a cool graphic showing the landing according to the received data, so if we see the rover sitting on the surface, we can assume most likely it was successful.

Posted by: Redstone Aug 5 2012, 01:19 AM

A little more info on risk analysis with MSL.

http://blogs.nature.com/news/2012/08/dont-be-terrified-curiosity-landing-less-risky-than-spirit-opportunity-and-viking.html

Quite reassuring, on several counts. But again, the risk assessment value is based on all hardware working as designed.

Interesting to see that the MER program accepted more than 1 in 10 chance of losing Spirit. Gutsy.

Posted by: algorimancer Aug 5 2012, 01:36 AM

Any chance that there's a plan to post the post-landing news conferences online somewhere, perhaps Youtube? With MER I was able to set my DVR to record from Nasa TV, but I dropped my cable a few years ago when I went back to school, and until now had no interest in going back to it (I've been getting by on broadcast and download rather nicely).

Posted by: Astro0 Aug 5 2012, 01:44 AM

My favourite place to get copies of any news conferences and video from NASA is:
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php

Available for download in hi-def.

ADMIN HAT ON: Can I remind everyone to read through the FAQs again. So many of the questions that have been asked in the last few pages are available as answers there.
</adminhat>

Posted by: gpurcell Aug 5 2012, 06:42 AM

Redstone, thanks for that link. I wonder if that over 10 percent failure probability is why JPL isn't too keen to use any more bouncing ball landings on Mars....

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 5 2012, 07:02 AM

It's more coincidence, I think. Phoenix was based on a previous legged lander design which had to use rockets, while MSL is just too heavy for the airbag system (barring some sudden breakthrough in material science). Airbags may well see further use someday.

Posted by: ugordan Aug 5 2012, 11:25 AM

They will most likely be posted on NASA's Youtube channel http://www.youtube.com/user/NASAtelevision/videos. The press conferences so far have been.

Posted by: MahFL Aug 5 2012, 11:33 AM

Airbags are not off the menu, they just could not design any strong enough for the weight of MSL, so rockets were needed.

Posted by: Skyrunner Aug 5 2012, 01:48 PM

Found this EDL timeline with a lot of events in different tome zones, perhaps it's handy http://www.spaceflight101.com/msl-edl-timeline.html I printed one of the PDF's and pinned it next to my bed

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 5 2012, 03:17 PM

Good one!

Posted by: pospa Aug 5 2012, 05:36 PM

Maybe this was discussed before, just I don't remember.
Do we know the sequence of MSL spacecraft components how they will fall on the Martian's surface?
Which part will have the first contact and which will be the latest one?
And maybe with some raw estimation of how far they can fall from the rover?

Something like:
1. - 2 x 75 kg tungsten CBMs
2. - Cruise stage debris
3. - 6 x 25 kg tungsten EBDMs
4. - Heatshield
5. - Rover
6. - Descent Stage
7. - Backshell + parachute

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 5 2012, 06:02 PM

IIRC it was already answered (by Doug). I will suggest http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&act=Search&mode=adv&f=0 his posts in this very same thread / group.

Posted by: siravan Aug 5 2012, 06:04 PM

If I understand the timing of the events right, the first hazcam images might be shot few seconds after the descent stage impact. I wonder if it is possible to see the "mushroom cloud" in the images (of course, assuming it is in the field of view).

Posted by: ugordan Aug 5 2012, 06:57 PM

I don't think you'd get a mushroom cloud. The atmosphere is very rarified and the impact would not heat up the air to produce convective, toroidal motion of a mushroom cloud. Some dust kicked up by the impact, sure. Also, the hazcams are very fisheye and they likely wouldn't show much detail of a dust cloud in the distance even if they managed to catch it.

Posted by: pospa Aug 5 2012, 07:05 PM

Found just posts about looking for all parts on HiRISE images after landing, not about impact/landing order or timing.
Never mind... I'm maybe too curious.

Posted by: kwan3217 Aug 5 2012, 09:55 PM

MSL simulation based on Spice kernels and actual topography, full real scale, full real time scale. I guess with Eyes on the Solar System, I won't need to do this anymore, but I was already most of the way done with this when I heard about Eyes.

http://youtu.be/vfOvPgeLDew

Skycrane doesn't look nearly so crazy when viewed in proper scale. In fact, what looks most scary to me is powered descent, hitting the brakes exactly the right time to hit the -0.75m/s speed at the right altitude.

Posted by: pac56 Aug 6 2012, 01:26 AM

In case of an emergency...
Is there a possibility to use the descent stage to brake MSL in case the parachute malfunctions?

Posted by: MahFL Aug 6 2012, 01:28 AM

No, not enough fuel or power.

Posted by: Keatah Aug 6 2012, 02:30 AM

Taken individually, each step in the EDL sequence seems logical and well thought out. It's the transitioning from one step to the next at the right time that's most important. It's where things can go wrong the quickest.

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 03:19 AM

Anybody who hasn't seen the official 5 minute video from the JPL EDL team (Adam Steltzer. et al.) should take look.
Its title is "7 Minutes of Terror".

My favorite line: "...It (EDL) is the result of reasoned engineering thought... and it still looks crazy..."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ki_Af_o9Q9s

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 03:54 AM

Doug on NASA TV right now!

EDIT: Nailed it, man.

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 04:01 AM

Doug, nice '3D'app' on that tablet! !!!

Posted by: craigmcg Aug 6 2012, 04:04 AM

Nice job!

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 04:07 AM

Inside Deimos orbit....

Posted by: dvandorn Aug 6 2012, 04:08 AM

According to the Eyes animation, Mars is presenting a truly iconic appearance to the approaching MSL, with Syrtis Major neatly centered in the rapidly swelling disk of the planet. Fine work by all involved, esp. Fearless Leader (aka JPL Visualization Engineer... ). You can truly place yourself right there.

-the other Doug

Posted by: Oersted Aug 6 2012, 04:16 AM

Where is the "Clean Feed" without commentary that the NASA PR lady was talking about?

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 04:17 AM

oDoug, to echo ElkGroveDan on the "Humor" thread, good to see you again as well!!!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 04:19 AM

http://www.ustream.tv/NASAJPL2

MAs info

http://solarsystem.nasa.gov/news/msl_landing.cfm

and

http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7375&hl=

Posted by: Stu Aug 6 2012, 04:19 AM

Managed to grab 3 hrs sleep, but back at desk now... sky brightening to a beautiful Lake District shade of "murky grey" outside... Coffee is on, peanuts are open...

Bring it on.

Posted by: helvick Aug 6 2012, 04:19 AM

Awesome job Mr Ellison - 400k users of Eyes on the solar system, yowzaa. Can't say I'm surprised as I have my own mini mission control running here - Eyes running on the HDTV is space nerd heaven, NASA TV streaming in on a tablet, UMSF on the main PC screen, Emily\Fraser & TBA on Google+ , Twitter on my phone...

Posted by: dvandorn Aug 6 2012, 04:21 AM

As Toff Markin said to Darth Vader, "This had better work."



-the other Doug

Posted by: Phil Stooke Aug 6 2012, 04:23 AM

Doug --- where did you suddenly appear from? We've been looking out for you for ages!

Phil

Posted by: Big Joe Aug 6 2012, 04:24 AM

Thank you for posting these links I hate watching "fill" for the next hour.

Posted by: dvandorn Aug 6 2012, 04:27 AM

Thanks for the kind wishes, guys. Life just got real busy and complicated, and I needed time for some things that couldn't come from anywhere else but the hours I would spend on this forum every day. That doesn't mean I haven't been lurking from time to time -- after all, where else can I get my fix of high-quality images from the Martian surface? Really been enjoying the pictures from Oppy, especially the latest of her straddling Whim Creek.

As for de-lurking tonight, I decided I couldn't experience this night without sharing it with my like-minded friends.

Good to see all of you, too.

-the other Doug

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 04:30 AM

I actually bailed early from Planetfest in Pasadena to be here as well...understand completely.

Let's do this thing.

EDIT: T minus 1 hour for Earth-returned time landing confirmation.

Posted by: Pando Aug 6 2012, 04:33 AM

One hour to go! Mars is growing by the minute in EotSS...

Posted by: Stu Aug 6 2012, 04:34 AM

Good to be here with you all... I'm ready here...

Buckle up!

Posted by: MarsEngineer Aug 6 2012, 04:35 AM

Hey everyone.

Rob here. I am in the CMSA at entry minus an hour. We have asked the DSN to turn off its transmitter and we are in listen-only mode right now.

I will be seated with Gay Hill on NASA TV just after 9 PDT tonight until Entry (and perhaps again jsut after landing). I am feeling a tad anxious. I can hear my heart beating in my voca headset.

There is a real party feel at JPL and around Pasadena right now. Our team in in a good but a bit surreal mood. This is my 5th time and it is always surreal.

I keep saying that we no longer need luck. If it works, we have already made it work. If it fails, we have already made it fail. No one to blame but ourselves.

Our nav estimate indicates that we will be only 250 m off from our projected target that we programmed in last week. Amazing.

I hope you have fun.

breeeath.

-Rob

Posted by: dvandorn Aug 6 2012, 04:35 AM

I was just in the middle of typing a post asking when we might get confirmation that Odyssey has completed its attitude change, when the NASA TV commentary announced they're in the middle of the turn, so I imagine we'll get some kind of a confirmation here in the next ten to twenty minutes. ***fingers and toes crossed***

However, I also note that the Navigation officer just called for a conference on a local loop, off the air. Hope nothing is wrong with any of assets at Mars or onboard the spacecraft.

-the other Doug

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 04:35 AM

NASATV just showed what the professionals are using; based on actual data, not the simulation.
Even a fuel gage!

Posted by: Stu Aug 6 2012, 04:39 AM

From all of us, Rob - Safe Landing. We're thinking of you.

Posted by: jekbradbury Aug 6 2012, 04:39 AM

The raw ustream feed showed some sort of simulation based on Google Mars, right next to Eyes

Posted by: MarsEngineer Aug 6 2012, 04:40 AM

Yep. The real thing. No more sims. No more testbeds.
Brreeeath.

-Rob Manning
still MSL Chief Engineer from CMSA.

Posted by: MarsEngineer Aug 6 2012, 04:41 AM

Thanks Stu. And thank all of you at UMSF.

-Rob

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 04:43 AM

Breathe indeed...we need ya!

Rock on, Rob. Awesomeness will occur, and even more of same after that.

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 04:46 AM

Dare Mighty Things

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 04:47 AM

Elachi and Bolden in the house....

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 04:48 AM

The POTUS will call them after landing too, right? I recall the MERS had that too, I think?

Posted by: chris Aug 6 2012, 04:49 AM

Fly fast and land safely!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 04:49 AM

I remember ARNOLD (then Gov. of California) showing up after success too...

Posted by: MahFL Aug 6 2012, 04:50 AM

The speed is really ramping up now on Eyes.

Posted by: Drkskywxlt Aug 6 2012, 04:51 AM

Definitely...Mars is getting awfully big in the window of EotSS. Noticeably bigger each time I click back to that window...

Posted by: dvandorn Aug 6 2012, 04:51 AM

So, we don't expect to start getting bent-pipe UHF through MODY until a couple of minutes after entry begins, and it will be ratty at first, according to what I just heard in the controllers' round-up? I imagine that means the Eyes animation will only start reflecting actual circumstances at about that time?

-the other Doug

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 04:51 AM

Over 10000 mph now according to eyes....

Posted by: Big Joe Aug 6 2012, 05:00 AM

Go on peanuts!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:00 AM

They're passing out the peanouts

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 05:01 AM

DEPLOY PEANUTS!!!!

Posted by: Oersted Aug 6 2012, 05:02 AM

I know this suggestion comes a bit late and I don't want to second-guess you EDL guys, but I was just thinking that you should perhaps have tried out another method...

Joking aside: thank you so much for your sacrifices, because we know you have made them, personally and family-wise, in high-intensity jobs like yours. It's six in the morning here and my four-month old girl is sleeping behind me in our darkened den. - Thanks for taking her and me and everybody else on a ride to Mars which will hopefully last for many years!

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:03 AM

Cruise stage should have separated by now, we'll know in 12 minutes...

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:05 AM

Rob (MarsEngineer) is talking to Gaye now on he commentary feed (http://www.ustream.tv/NASAJPL)

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:05 AM

Still early for that. 4:00 more minutes

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:08 AM

Odyssey status "for the slew, things look good at this point"

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:08 AM

Thanks, Dan. Must have mixed something up.

Odyssey in position!

Posted by: Drkskywxlt Aug 6 2012, 05:08 AM

Odyssey maneuver successful!

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 6 2012, 05:10 AM

Morning all from here in Spain. Just started my second cup of coffee.

Less than 6min to confirm cruise stage separation.

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:11 AM

Mars is getting big in the window!

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 6 2012, 05:11 AM

AFAIK, Eyes is working on ERT.

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:12 AM

Yes that's what I figured, so I subtracted 14 mins from all the times.

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:12 AM

Just woke up at 5 am in my time zone to follow everything live. Curiosity has now entered the Martian atmosphere but we'll not hear about until it until about 14 minutes from now.

Posted by: Phil Stooke Aug 6 2012, 05:13 AM

Watching from Victoria BC - best landing coverage since Apollo!

Phil

Posted by: gpurcell Aug 6 2012, 05:14 AM

No kidding, Phil. The visualization is astonishing even compared to MER (let alone Pathfinder when I actually drove out to Tidbinbilla to see the feed)

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:14 AM

tones about to come down

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:15 AM

We have separation!

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 05:16 AM

Cruise stage sep.

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:16 AM

Cruise stage separation, the first big 'change'.

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:19 AM

There goes the ballast!

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:21 AM

It's all over now in 'real time'; now just to wait for the signals...

Posted by: CosmicRocker Aug 6 2012, 05:21 AM

This Eyes application is astounding.

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:21 AM

Here we go into "Seven minutes of terror."

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 05:21 AM

Rob Manning guiding us through EDL on NASA TV (thanks Rob!)

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:22 AM

Interestingly, Curiosity is now already on Mars' surface but the speed of light isn't fast enough for anyone to know in what condition ;-).

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:22 AM

MRO above the horizon, recording...

Posted by: Big Joe Aug 6 2012, 05:23 AM

Trying not to hold my breath :-)

Posted by: Drkskywxlt Aug 6 2012, 05:23 AM

Everyone in Mission Control looks twitchy...

Posted by: TheChemist Aug 6 2012, 05:23 AM

Here 's to a safe landing on Mars today !

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:24 AM

EOTSS seems to be a bit out of sync..a minute or two fast...or at least on my machine.

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:25 AM

I'm a couple secs behind the stream myself.

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:26 AM

"vehicle reports entry infterface"

Posted by: craigmcg Aug 6 2012, 05:26 AM

Me too

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:26 AM

Things starting to happen really fast now...

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 6 2012, 05:26 AM

You have to adjust your local clock.

Posted by: Oersted Aug 6 2012, 05:26 AM

Slowing down!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:26 AM

started guided entry

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 6 2012, 05:27 AM

Entry Interface. Hold your breath!

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:27 AM

Data from Odyssey!

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:29 AM

More ballast gone! Look out below!

Posted by: Drkskywxlt Aug 6 2012, 05:30 AM

Chute!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:30 AM

chute deploy

Posted by: craigmcg Aug 6 2012, 05:30 AM

Dashboard on display!

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 6 2012, 05:31 AM

Powered descent should start in seconds...

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:32 AM

Powered flight!

Posted by: Phil Stooke Aug 6 2012, 05:33 AM

40 m!

Phil

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:33 AM

Skycrane!

Posted by: Drkskywxlt Aug 6 2012, 05:33 AM

Skycrane starting! Touchdown!!

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:33 AM

DOWN!!

Posted by: Tesheiner Aug 6 2012, 05:33 AM

YEAH!!!!! TOUCHDOWN CONFIRMED!

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:33 AM

LANDING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Pando Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

TOUCHDOWN!!!!!!

Posted by: Eluchil Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

Touchdown confirmed! Good job Rob et al.

Posted by: chris Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

Yes!

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

W O W! ! !

Posted by: ugordan Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

Phew!!

Posted by: Graham Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

We're down!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

We are safe on Mars....!!

Posted by: Oersted Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

Crying with joy here.

Posted by: Decepticon Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

WoW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:34 AM

Rube Goldberg has been vindicated!

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:35 AM

Images coming down!!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:35 AM

pictures?!?!?! OMFG

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 05:35 AM

Images coming down ... thumbnails

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:35 AM

HOLY COW thumbnails already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 05:35 AM

Thumbnails down!!!!

Posted by: Explorer1 Aug 6 2012, 05:35 AM

THere it is! Looks just like MER hazcams!

Posted by: lyford Aug 6 2012, 05:36 AM

"wheels down on mars!!!"

Posted by: Nix Aug 6 2012, 05:36 AM

big phew here too

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:36 AM

Argghhh, didn't hit 'Print Screen' fast enough to grab an image thumbnail ;-).

Posted by: Graham Aug 6 2012, 05:36 AM

It's a wheel

Posted by: Gladstoner Aug 6 2012, 05:36 AM

Nice view of the sunset.

Posted by: jekbradbury Aug 6 2012, 05:37 AM

"Keep watching the screen! There's more stuff!"
Loving it.

Posted by: dvandorn Aug 6 2012, 05:37 AM

It's a thumbnail from a hazcam, but we have a hazy horizon and a wheel in the dirt.

Welcome to Mars, everyone.

-the other Doug

Posted by: PDP8E Aug 6 2012, 05:37 AM

1st thumbnail is 64x64 rear hazcam... waiting for a 256x256 next ....

Posted by: Big Joe Aug 6 2012, 05:37 AM

Wonderful!

Posted by: Pando Aug 6 2012, 05:37 AM

First image!

Posted by: kwan3217 Aug 6 2012, 05:38 AM

I told you it would work!

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:38 AM

OK Phil Stooke, take those images and tell us where we are

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:39 AM

Quick screen grab:

Edit: The first full size image, quick-and-dirty brightness/contrast adjustment by me.

Posted by: gpurcell Aug 6 2012, 05:40 AM

I love seeing that shadowed silhouette of MSL.

Posted by: Leither Aug 6 2012, 05:41 AM

Truly fantastic - look at that shadow. Looking forward to the next 10 years and more...

Posted by: Bjorn Jonsson Aug 6 2012, 05:43 AM

Interestingly, the surface seems much less rocky to me (or at least the rocks are smaller) than at the Viking, Pathfinder and Spirit landing sites.

Posted by: nprev Aug 6 2012, 05:46 AM

I am in awe. Finally got the tears out of my eyes.

We're down. Let's talk about it on the new http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7397&hl= thread.

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Aug 6 2012, 05:47 AM

EDL topic closed. Discussion continues at http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7397&hl=