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Space Policy (february 2006)
Guest_AlexBlackwell_*
post Feb 2 2006, 04:49 PM
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For those who do not have access, note that Elsevier/ScienceDirect typically offers free online access to each year's first published issue of any given journal, access that expires at the end of the year. In this instance, the publishers are offering free online access to the February 2006 issue of Space Policy. If the previous link doesn't work, try this one.

EDIT: In the original post I conflated the first two months of the year and typed in that new hybrid month of "Fanuary." blink.gif

This post has been edited by AlexBlackwell: Feb 2 2006, 05:11 PM
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ljk4-1
post Feb 2 2006, 05:00 PM
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Thank you once again, Alex!

Not to be missed from the collection:

“Space superiority”: Wernher von Braun's campaign for a nuclear-armed space station, 1946–1956 • ARTICLE

Pages 52-62

Michael J. Neufeld

SummaryPlus | Full Text + Links | PDF (257 K)

The literature on the history of spaceflight has depicted the early 1950s Collier’s articles mostly as a forerunner to the peaceful and scientific exploration of space. Yet the centerpiece of Wernher von Braun's plan was a manned space station that would serve as reconnaissance platform and orbiting battle station for achieving “space superiority” over the USSR. One its roles could be the launching of nuclear missiles. When challenged as to the station's defensibility, von Braun even posited pre-emptive atomic strikes from space as a response to the development of a hostile anti-satellite capability.


G. Douglas, Editor, The Scientific Legacy of Fred Hoyle, Cambridge University Press, Cambridge (2005) ISBN 0-521-82448-6 (249pp., $75.00). • BOOK REVIEW

Pages 71-72

Richard Boudreault

SummaryPlus | Full Text + Links | PDF (114 K)


--------------------
"After having some business dealings with men, I am occasionally chagrined,
and feel as if I had done some wrong, and it is hard to forget the ugly circumstance.
I see that such intercourse long continued would make one thoroughly prosaic, hard,
and coarse. But the longest intercourse with Nature, though in her rudest moods, does
not thus harden and make coarse. A hard, sensible man whom we liken to a rock is
indeed much harder than a rock. From hard, coarse, insensible men with whom I have
no sympathy, I go to commune with the rocks, whose hearts are comparatively soft."

- Henry David Thoreau, November 15, 1853

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Bob Shaw
post Feb 2 2006, 06:22 PM
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QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ Feb 2 2006, 06:00 PM)
“Space superiority”: Wernher von Braun's campaign for a nuclear-armed space station, 1946–1956

When challenged as to the station's defensibility, von Braun even posited pre-emptive atomic strikes from space as a response to the development of a hostile anti-satellite capability.

*


Dr Strangelove, I presume?

Oh, I forgot, good ol' Werner neffer knew nuffink about any mines or unterground prrrrrooooduction vaaaciliiiiiiiities, so it can't have been him in the War Room after all! One of his V2s blew my father up, though not seriously...

Bob Shaw


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Remember: Time Flies like the wind - but Fruit Flies like bananas!
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Stephen
post Mar 8 2006, 01:11 AM
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QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Feb 2 2006, 06:22 PM) *
Dr Strangelove, I presume?

Oh, I forgot, good ol' Werner neffer knew nuffink about any mines or unterground prrrrrooooduction vaaaciliiiiiiiities, so it can't have been him in the War Room after all! One of his V2s blew my father up, though not seriously...
So what's your point? That (nearly) blowing your father up with a bomb sent on an unconventional V2 was not nice (whereas, presumably, blowing him up with a bomb dropped from a conventional plane would have been way more acceptable) or that "good ol' Werner" was not only the one who developed the V2 but was the one who pushed the button which launched the V2 which blew up your father?

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Stephen
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Bob Shaw
post Mar 8 2006, 06:25 PM
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QUOTE (Stephen @ Mar 8 2006, 01:11 AM) *
So what's your point? That (nearly) blowing your father up with a bomb sent on an unconventional V2 was not nice (whereas, presumably, blowing him up with a bomb dropped from a conventional plane would have been way more acceptable) or that "good ol' Werner" was not only the one who developed the V2 but was the one who pushed the button which launched the V2 which blew up your father?

======
Stephen



Stephen:

I don't take it personally that Werner Von Braun blew my late father up a bit; but I do think that, although we have much to thank Von Braun for, the cost of that knowledge was way too high. Consider the Faustian bargain he struck with the Nazi state, and compare it to the approach of the many German physicists and other scientists who didn't sell out to Hitler. Von Braun was a monster; to some extent he's 'our' monster, but a monster he remains!

Bob Shaw


--------------------
Remember: Time Flies like the wind - but Fruit Flies like bananas!
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David
post Mar 8 2006, 06:33 PM
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QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 8 2006, 06:25 PM) *
Consider the Faustian bargain he struck with the Nazi state, and compare it to the approach of the many German physicists and other scientists who didn't sell out to Hitler.


"Call him a Nazi, he won't even frown --
'Ha, Nazi, schmazi' says Wernher von Braun.

Don't say that he's hypocritical
Say rather that he's apolitical.

'Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down?
'That's not my department,' says Wernher von Braun."

--Tom Lehrer, Wernher von Braun
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Stephen
post Mar 9 2006, 10:06 AM
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QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 8 2006, 06:25 PM) *
Stephen:

I don't take it personally that Werner Von Braun blew my late father up a bit; but I do think that, although we have much to thank Von Braun for, the cost of that knowledge was way too high. Consider the Faustian bargain he struck with the Nazi state....
Where does that put all the nuclear physicists who joined America's Manhattan project? Did they not strike a Faustian bargain of their own with the American government? Not to mention Einstein, who while taking no part in the project itself was one of those who signed the now-famous letter urging the US president to build an atomic bomb before the Nazis did.

More to the point here that project ended up developing a weapon far more deadly and devastating than anything von Braun put together in Nazi Germany. If the cost of von Braun's knowledge is considered to be "way too high" what of the knowledge gained from the Manhattan project?

Of course, one might argue that the latter was in a better cause, but then that assumes that developing a weapon to blow up Germans and Japanese is a more virtuous cause than developing a weapon to blow up Americans and Britons.

QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 8 2006, 06:25 PM) *
...and compare it to the approach of the many German physicists and other scientists who didn't sell out to Hitler. Von Braun was a monster; to some extent he's 'our' monster, but a monster he remains!
I have no figures, but for all the "many German physicists and other scientists" you say "didn't sell out to Hitler" I suspect many more did. After all, the Nazi-state did not collapse for wont of scientific or technical expertise. As one source explains:
"Many German academics, scientists, and technicians had been members of the Nazi Party, often because party membership brought benefits such as research grants and promotions."


Presumably those other "academics, scientists, and technicians" made Faustian bargains of their own. Are they "monsters" also? Or is von Braun a special case because of the V2? Or because you regard him as bearing special responsibility for the V2?

Either way, I fail to see how that makes von Braun more of a monster than anybody else who works to develop instruments of war, or which are later turned into instruments of war, including those who worked in the American or British armament industries during World War II and so helped to win the war against the Axis Powers.

So what exactly is von Braun's sin: that he helped the world gain forbidden knowledge it would now be better off without or that he collaborated with, and delivered forbidden knowledge to, a repellant regime now all but regarded as evil incarnate, without a single redeeming quality. (Mussolini is at least said to have made the Italian railways run on time, but can anybody name a single good thing the Nazis are credited to have done for Germany?)

======
Stephen
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helvick
post Mar 9 2006, 10:28 AM
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QUOTE (Stephen @ Mar 9 2006, 10:06 AM) *
(Mussolini is at least said to have made the Italian railways run on time, but can anybody name a single good thing the Nazis are credited to have done for Germany?)


Godwins Law is getting dangerously close to being invoked here so I'm treading carefully.

Mussolini did not make the trains run on time - from Snopes

Apart from the militarist stuff the Nazis gave Germany the Autobahns and the VW Beetle to name two. Mind you there's no way that I can assert that these wouldn't have come out of Germany at the time in any case.

And since we were neutral during the war I'm going to shut up now.
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Guest_AlexBlackwell_*
post Mar 9 2006, 04:44 PM
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I'm beginning to regret that I even started this thread cool.gif
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Bob Shaw
post Mar 9 2006, 07:32 PM
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QUOTE (AlexBlackwell @ Mar 9 2006, 04:44 PM) *
I'm beginning to regret that I even started this thread cool.gif


Alex:

Perhaps a little light pruning is in order?

Bob Shaw


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Remember: Time Flies like the wind - but Fruit Flies like bananas!
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