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OPAG Reports, Formal proposals/evaluations of future outer SS missions
JRehling
post Nov 9 2007, 08:28 PM
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http://www.lpi.usra.edu/opag/announcements.html

That's one little URL with a lifetime's worth of reading material.

Three detailed studies are available in PDF format. The missing body is Titan, which will be the subject of a forthcoming report.

The three focus missions are:
Europa Explorer: Fairly detailed description of a mission that is pretty much what Europa Orbiter would have been.

Jupiter System Observer: Basically, Galileo 2 (without the antenna mishap!). The craft would start with a 3-year tour of all the Galileans, then spend 1 year in an elliptical Ganymede orbit, then the rest of the mission in a tight, polar Ganymede orbit (like MGS at Mars). That would map the heck out of Ganymede, but also be close enough to the rest of the system to make long-range observations for years. Note that Ganymede would thereby provide a lot of radiation shielding.

Enceladus: where three profiles are examined in depth: Enceladus Orbiter only; Enceladus Orbiter with soft lander; Saturn orbiter with Enceladus soft lander.

There's more to chew on here than I have had (or may ever have) time for, but I'll throw in my two cents' worth:

Seems like a Europa-only mission would only benefit from coming after a JSO. EE would explore Europa much better than JSO would; why even have JSO observations at Europa if EE came first? In many ways, these two missions are competitive. EE would have the big payoff, but JSO seems like basic recon that would prime EE, especially giving specs on radar performance. But if we waited til JSO was 4 years into its mission before completing design of EE, then put EE sometime mid-century.

If an Enceladus mission included a Saturn orbiter, then maybe the same orbiter could provide data relay for separate Titan elements. However, a lot of the Enceladus science goals would require an Enceladus orbiter, so I don't think a Saturn orbiter for Enceladus/Titan will win out.

Note that Enceladus orbital velocity is low enough that the craft could manage to take lots of hits from ice pellets and survive. Put a bulletproof vest on the craft and let it soar through the plumes endlessly.
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edstrick
post Nov 20 2007, 10:22 AM
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(Without reading the voluminous material on the opag site...)

Would a JSO mission have a higher angular resolution camera than Cassini's narrow angle cam?...
Would it be a multi-megapixel camera, 4-megapixel camera on Rosetta, or even higher pixel-count-format?
Would it be able to take images every few seconds, rather than about one per minute?...
Would it have many times more data storage than Cassini, and be able to dump it all to Earth during apoapsis, as it heads in for the next encounter?

As Meriner 10 approached and receeded from Mercury, it "fireshosed" the illuminated disk with continuous mosaicing until the field of view and frame rate became too small and slow to get contiguous coverage.

Voyager was somewhat able to do the same at Jupiter with the flyby-targeted moons.
Galileo was a salvage job.. very successful, but still a salvage job.

A current technology mission should be able to saturate-cover the illuminated disc with multi-spectral images down to maybe 1/4 kilometer with higher camera resolution from long range, a faster frame rate, and more data storage and transmission capability. Maybe even UV/VIS/NIR color coverage at that resolution. During near-encounter, they should be able to do "quadrangle-maps" of target regions with several strips of contiguouis images down to something like 50 meters, much the way Viking Orbiters mapped landing sites with the twin rapid-fire framing cameras and it's scan platform.

I'm not going to vote on Europa vs Jovian System, but we damn near better be able to do as much better at Jupiter than Cassini does at Saturn, as Cassini did over poor Galileo.

Beyond that... Near Infrared imaging is vastly advanced over Cassini's technology level.. A megapixel 1 to 5 <maybe> micrometer framing camera with a good set of wide and narrow band filters should be state-of-the-art and extend multispectal mapping at good resolution to longer, more diagnostic wavelengths.
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tedstryk
post Nov 20 2007, 12:38 PM
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QUOTE (edstrick @ Nov 20 2007, 10:22 AM) *
Voyager was somewhat able to do the same at Jupiter with the flyby-targeted moons.
Galileo was a salvage job.. very successful, but still a salvage job.


Yes, Galileo was a salvage job, but it did have some encounters that did not fall into this category, namely its earth-moon flybys, which give one an idea of what SSI was really capable. Also, when one looks at the ultra-high resolution mosaics from its high-speed flybys of the Galileans, the short integration led to images that are neatly nested, especially compared to Cassini mosaics. I would love to see a JSO or EE with a Rosetta-sized (at least) camera with a fast integration time. In fact, it could do more than Mariner 10 if it had reaction wheels, because the coverage could be neatly nested, as opposed to Mariner 10, which appeared to bounce all over the place.


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nprev
post Nov 20 2007, 02:30 PM
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QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 20 2007, 04:38 AM) *
I would love to see a JSO or EE with a Rosetta-sized (at least) camera with a fast integration time.


I completely agree, and this seems technically feasible, of course. In fact that's the strongest argument yet for merging these mission proposals. Completing a full Jovian system survey should be the primary objective, and after this task is complete the spacecraft should be capable of orbiting Europa or Ganymede, with target selection determined by the survey findings.

Building in adaptability seems like the best way to resolve this conflict. The main idea here is to acquire enough information about the Galileans to make an informed choice when the time comes (though I suspect that the meetings will be real roof-raisers; heck, look how much discussion there's been on this thread alone!)


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ugordan
post Nov 20 2007, 02:48 PM
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QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 20 2007, 03:30 PM) *
Building in adaptability seems like the best way to resolve this conflict.

Adaptability will inevitably imply sub-optimality for either Europa or Ganymede. You want to optimize your payload (science instruments, rad shielding, fuel) for a specific target, there's no margin like that to accomodate free choice once you get there. It's not a case of choosing the landing site a-la Viking from orbital survey first. You'd inevitably have an impact on science capability to allow for those margins. Once again, it boils down to "do you really want to sacrifice X in order to be able to do Y?". Just as EE sacrifices coverage of the entire system and JSO would leave certain questions open if you went into Europan orbit.


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djellison
post Nov 20 2007, 02:57 PM
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QUOTE (ugordan @ Nov 20 2007, 02:48 PM) *
You want to optimize your payload ... for a specific target


Should that target be a specific body, or a specifc set of scientific goals?

Doug
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ugordan
post Nov 20 2007, 03:16 PM
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QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 03:57 PM) *
Should that target be a specific body, or a specifc set of scientific goals?

Probably scientific goals. Some goals can be pretty constraining though, suggesting you end up with a target body again. We're back at that point: would we like a little bit of everything (possibly best bang per buck), or do we want a quantum leap in knowledge about a single object?


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Posts in this topic
- JRehling   OPAG Reports   Nov 9 2007, 08:28 PM
- - Mariner9   Drats. Everytime I try to download the Europa rep...   Nov 12 2007, 08:19 PM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (Mariner9 @ Nov 12 2007, 12:19 PM) ...   Nov 12 2007, 08:42 PM
|- - vjkane   QUOTE (Mariner9 @ Nov 12 2007, 08:19 PM) ...   Nov 12 2007, 08:57 PM
- - vjkane   Some more details comparing the Europa explorer an...   Nov 13 2007, 05:14 PM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (vjkane @ Nov 13 2007, 09:14 AM) So...   Nov 13 2007, 07:39 PM
|- - JRehling   The full Europa Explorer report is now up. More re...   Nov 13 2007, 10:38 PM
- - PhilCo126   Again this points out we live in exciting times, w...   Nov 13 2007, 06:08 PM
- - volcanopele   Sweet! Obviously, the two that I favor are JS...   Nov 14 2007, 07:38 PM
|- - vjkane   QUOTE (volcanopele @ Nov 14 2007, 07:38 P...   Nov 14 2007, 08:01 PM
- - volcanopele   Yes, if the only difference were which moon was or...   Nov 14 2007, 08:07 PM
|- - vjkane   I've taken a look through the JSO and Europa E...   Nov 16 2007, 12:39 AM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (vjkane @ Nov 15 2007, 04:39 PM) I...   Nov 18 2007, 10:14 PM
|- - rlorenz   QUOTE (JRehling @ Nov 18 2007, 05:14 PM) ...   Nov 19 2007, 01:37 AM
|- - tedstryk   I tend to favor JSO due to the better Io coverage,...   Nov 19 2007, 11:37 AM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (rlorenz @ Nov 18 2007, 05:37 PM) I...   Nov 19 2007, 06:06 PM
- - ngunn   I tend to agree. Whereas EE is really a fixed-term...   Nov 19 2007, 01:23 PM
- - nprev   Although I'm not really a Europaphile myself, ...   Nov 19 2007, 01:48 PM
|- - tedstryk   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 19 2007, 01:48 PM) Alt...   Nov 19 2007, 06:05 PM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 19 2007, 10:05 AM) ...   Nov 19 2007, 06:21 PM
||- - tedstryk   Two things that I would really like to see are lon...   Nov 19 2007, 06:44 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 19 2007, 07:05 PM) ...   Nov 19 2007, 06:45 PM
||- - volcanopele   QUOTE (ugordan @ Nov 19 2007, 11:45 AM) I...   Nov 19 2007, 07:10 PM
|||- - ugordan   QUOTE (volcanopele @ Nov 19 2007, 08:10 P...   Nov 19 2007, 07:19 PM
||- - ngunn   QUOTE (ugordan @ Nov 19 2007, 06:45 PM) b...   Nov 19 2007, 10:28 PM
||- - ugordan   QUOTE (ngunn @ Nov 19 2007, 11:28 PM) If ...   Nov 19 2007, 10:43 PM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 19 2007, 10:05 AM) ...   Nov 19 2007, 06:56 PM
|- - vjkane   I think that the discussion of which moon is more ...   Nov 19 2007, 08:46 PM
|- - tedstryk   I still fail to see what makes Europa so much more...   Nov 19 2007, 09:46 PM
||- - nprev   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 19 2007, 01:46 PM) ...   Nov 19 2007, 10:13 PM
||- - tedstryk   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 19 2007, 10:13 PM) The...   Nov 19 2007, 10:25 PM
|- - Juramike   Here's my rundown (pretty much mentioned by vj...   Nov 19 2007, 11:36 PM
|- - tedstryk   I think that the additional time observing the Jov...   Nov 20 2007, 12:13 AM
|- - NMRguy   QUOTE (vjkane @ Nov 19 2007, 12:36 AM) Wh...   Nov 20 2007, 12:42 AM
- - nprev   Hmm again...keeping up with all these great argume...   Nov 19 2007, 08:42 PM
- - nprev   Ted, when I said "public", should've...   Nov 19 2007, 10:34 PM
- - nprev   Man, this thread is on fire...great stuff, though....   Nov 19 2007, 10:55 PM
- - volcanopele   Again, the problem is that the EE has nothing to w...   Nov 19 2007, 11:00 PM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (volcanopele @ Nov 20 2007, 12:00 A...   Nov 19 2007, 11:10 PM
|- - vjkane   Just to add more fun to this debate, a long time a...   Nov 19 2007, 11:32 PM
- - Mariner9   I'm surprised that almost the entire debate se...   Nov 20 2007, 12:07 AM
- - djellison   You could make those same arguments regarding the ...   Nov 20 2007, 12:10 AM
|- - Mariner9   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 19 2007, 04:10 PM)...   Nov 20 2007, 01:08 AM
- - vjkane   The swing argument in favor of making the next Fla...   Nov 20 2007, 01:29 AM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (vjkane @ Nov 19 2007, 05:29 PM) Th...   Nov 20 2007, 02:17 AM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 19 2007, 09:17 PM) ......   Nov 20 2007, 06:11 AM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (centsworth_II @ Nov 19 2007, 10:11...   Nov 20 2007, 07:15 AM
- - vjkane   I've been trying to think of creative solution...   Nov 20 2007, 04:47 AM
- - dvandorn   This discussion is interesting in that it seems to...   Nov 20 2007, 05:45 AM
- - volcanopele   The one good thing about EE is that it would be a ...   Nov 20 2007, 07:30 AM
- - edstrick   (Without reading the voluminous material on the op...   Nov 20 2007, 10:22 AM
|- - tedstryk   QUOTE (edstrick @ Nov 20 2007, 10:22 AM) ...   Nov 20 2007, 12:38 PM
||- - tedstryk   One thing to add. I would quickly defect from my ...   Nov 20 2007, 02:24 PM
||- - nprev   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 20 2007, 04:38 AM) ...   Nov 20 2007, 02:30 PM
||- - ugordan   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 20 2007, 03:30 PM) Bui...   Nov 20 2007, 02:48 PM
||- - djellison   QUOTE (ugordan @ Nov 20 2007, 02:48 PM) Y...   Nov 20 2007, 02:57 PM
||- - ugordan   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 03:57 PM)...   Nov 20 2007, 03:16 PM
||- - tedstryk   QUOTE (ugordan @ Nov 20 2007, 03:16 PM) P...   Nov 20 2007, 03:40 PM
||- - JRehling   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 20 2007, 07:40 AM) ...   Nov 20 2007, 06:38 PM
|- - vjkane   QUOTE (edstrick @ Nov 20 2007, 10:22 AM) ...   Nov 20 2007, 02:33 PM
- - nprev   No question at all that there would be trade-offs,...   Nov 20 2007, 03:05 PM
- - Juramike   I agree with ugordan, scientific goals should driv...   Nov 20 2007, 04:37 PM
- - nprev   Looks more & more like we're not going to ...   Nov 20 2007, 07:08 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 20 2007, 07:08 PM) . I...   Nov 20 2007, 07:12 PM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 11:12 AM)...   Nov 20 2007, 07:16 PM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 02:12 PM)...   Nov 20 2007, 08:20 PM
||- - djellison   QUOTE (centsworth_II @ Nov 20 2007, 08:20...   Nov 20 2007, 08:48 PM
||- - JRehling   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 12:48 PM)...   Nov 21 2007, 05:02 AM
||- - tedstryk   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 08:48 PM)...   Nov 21 2007, 02:30 PM
|||- - vjkane   QUOTE (tedstryk @ Nov 21 2007, 02:30 PM) ...   Nov 21 2007, 03:58 PM
||- - mchan   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 12:48 PM)...   Nov 21 2007, 04:02 PM
|- - tedstryk   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 20 2007, 07:12 PM)...   Nov 20 2007, 10:28 PM
- - volcanopele   LOL Yeah, that's a good point to keep in mind...   Nov 20 2007, 07:24 PM
- - ngunn   I've scanned the Enceladus report and was surp...   Nov 20 2007, 08:41 PM
- - vjkane   I stole a little time at lunch to compare camera r...   Nov 20 2007, 09:25 PM
- - vjkane   For camera resolutions from different missions at ...   Nov 20 2007, 09:28 PM
- - mchan   Very much enjoying the discussion here. For EE, d...   Nov 21 2007, 05:23 AM
- - djellison   I thought about adding Ulysses - but in terms of t...   Nov 21 2007, 02:49 PM
- - Bjorn Jonsson   Having skimmed through these reports (I need to re...   Nov 21 2007, 04:34 PM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (Bjorn Jonsson @ Nov 21 2007, 11:34...   Nov 21 2007, 05:21 PM
|- - JRehling   QUOTE (centsworth_II @ Nov 21 2007, 09:21...   Nov 21 2007, 05:40 PM
- - Bjorn Jonsson   I should clarify that the main reasons I find the ...   Nov 21 2007, 06:08 PM
- - djellison   Saturnian and Jovians systems - They're both i...   Nov 21 2007, 06:49 PM
- - Geographer   How much more expensive would a Saturnian mission ...   Nov 22 2007, 02:04 PM
- - Mariner9   On the surface of things, you would think that a S...   Nov 22 2007, 03:39 PM
- - Bjorn Jonsson   True - but there's one problem: A Jupiter grav...   Nov 22 2007, 04:42 PM
|- - Mariner9   QUOTE (Bjorn Jonsson @ Nov 22 2007, 08:42...   Nov 22 2007, 07:41 PM
- - nprev   Does JPL or another agency maintain a launch oppor...   Nov 22 2007, 05:21 PM
|- - gndonald   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 23 2007, 02:21 AM) Doe...   Nov 22 2007, 10:12 PM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (gndonald @ Nov 22 2007, 02:12 PM) ...   Nov 22 2007, 10:42 PM
|- - Del Palmer   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 22 2007, 10:42 PM) Yea...   Nov 22 2007, 11:20 PM
- - nprev   I stand corrected: Gary Flandro is an American, wo...   Nov 23 2007, 12:24 AM
|- - ugordan   QUOTE (nprev @ Nov 23 2007, 01:24 AM) Poi...   Nov 23 2007, 09:55 AM
- - edstrick   My brain's bouncing off a statement made a cou...   Nov 23 2007, 07:37 AM
|- - rlorenz   QUOTE (edstrick @ Nov 23 2007, 02:37 AM) ...   Nov 23 2007, 01:42 PM
|- - nprev   QUOTE (rlorenz @ Nov 23 2007, 05:42 AM) A...   Nov 23 2007, 03:25 PM
|- - vjkane   QUOTE (rlorenz @ Nov 23 2007, 01:42 PM) A...   Nov 23 2007, 05:39 PM
- - nprev   Thought so; in fact, seems as if I saw a recent pa...   Nov 23 2007, 10:51 AM
- - Floyd   The problem is what do you mean by "very favo...   Nov 23 2007, 01:02 PM
- - ngunn   All agog to read the Titan OPAG report when it app...   Nov 23 2007, 01:56 PM
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