First open lava tube may have been found, by Kaguya team |
First open lava tube may have been found, by Kaguya team |
Oct 26 2009, 06:02 PM
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 202 Joined: 9-September 08 Member No.: 4334 |
The New Scientist website has an article saying that an opening which might be a lava tube mouth has been found in Kaguya images.
Wasn't there a proposal (possibly from one of the Lunar X Prize teams?) of a Lava Tube Explorer rover? This might be a possible destination... |
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Oct 26 2009, 06:14 PM
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#2
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Solar System Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 10229 Joined: 5-April 05 From: Canada Member No.: 227 |
Yes, that proposal was from Astrobotic, for a follow-on lander after the GLXP attempt. I think they imagined driving into an open cave mouth, not descending vertically into a pit.
If solar proton-produced water can migrate to the poles and gather in shadowed crater floors, I assume it can also gather in a hole like this. Here it would also be protected from micrometeorite erosion. Phil -------------------- ... because the Solar System ain't gonna map itself.
Also to be found posting similar content on https://mastodon.social/@PhilStooke Maps for download (free PDF: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...Cartography.pdf NOTE: everything created by me which I post on UMSF is considered to be in the public domain (NOT CC, public domain) |
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Oct 27 2009, 11:24 AM
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#3
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Solar System Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 10229 Joined: 5-April 05 From: Canada Member No.: 227 |
-------------------- ... because the Solar System ain't gonna map itself.
Also to be found posting similar content on https://mastodon.social/@PhilStooke Maps for download (free PDF: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...Cartography.pdf NOTE: everything created by me which I post on UMSF is considered to be in the public domain (NOT CC, public domain) |
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Oct 27 2009, 12:11 PM
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#4
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1452 Joined: 26-July 08 Member No.: 4270 |
What amazes me is how circular this feature, and its counterparts on Mars, appear in images of them.
-------------------- -- Hungry4info (Sirius_Alpha)
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Guest_mcgyver_* |
Nov 12 2009, 05:12 PM
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#5
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Guests |
I thought lava was never suposed to have flown around on the moon...
Anyway it would be a great discovery: it wuld save TONS of money in building a permanent base on the moon, if we can just hide inside a cavern, rather than inflating an habitat and covering it with regolite! |
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Nov 12 2009, 06:32 PM
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 128 Joined: 28-October 08 From: Boston, MA Member No.: 4469 |
The lunar maria were created by lava flows billions of years ago. I think the most recent of these happened 1.2 billion years ago, so presumably the lava tubes are at least that old. Probably much older, depending on their locations... I'm assuming that the lava tubes can be dated by the age of the surrounding basalt.
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Guest_mcgyver_* |
Nov 12 2009, 08:00 PM
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#7
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Guests |
The lunar maria were created by lava flows billions of years ago. I think the most recent of these happened 1.2 billion years ago, so presumably the lava tubes are at least that old. Probably much older, depending on their locations... I'm assuming that the lava tubes can be dated by the age of the surrounding basalt. but it was not volcanic activity, if I remember correctly lava came out due to asteroids impacts. lava tube require active volcanoes. |
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Nov 12 2009, 08:14 PM
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#8
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Merciless Robot Group: Admin Posts: 8785 Joined: 8-December 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 602 |
The Moon did have vulcanism way, way back in the day; there are cinder cones scattered around. It's all ancient, of course.
-------------------- A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
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Nov 12 2009, 08:21 PM
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#9
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Solar System Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 10229 Joined: 5-April 05 From: Canada Member No.: 227 |
mcgyver, you are a bit out of date. The argument you are making was espoused by Harold Urey in the 1960s. The other view was championed by Gene Shoemaker. Apollo samples, most of which are basalt lava, proved Urey wrong, as he was quick to admit. There's a really good book on this, 'To a Rocky Moon' by Don Wilhelms. Well worth a read.
Phil -------------------- ... because the Solar System ain't gonna map itself.
Also to be found posting similar content on https://mastodon.social/@PhilStooke Maps for download (free PDF: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...Cartography.pdf NOTE: everything created by me which I post on UMSF is considered to be in the public domain (NOT CC, public domain) |
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Nov 12 2009, 08:39 PM
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#10
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Senior Member Group: Admin Posts: 4763 Joined: 15-March 05 From: Glendale, AZ Member No.: 197 |
the most recent of these happened 1.2 billion years ago, so presumably the lava tubes are at least that old. Sure it's a good price, but something that old is going to need a new roof, and I can't even imagine what shape the plumbing is in. Lava tube? More like a money pit. -------------------- If Occam had heard my theory, things would be very different now.
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Nov 12 2009, 11:45 PM
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 259 Joined: 23-January 05 From: Seattle, WA Member No.: 156 |
I think it's worth mentioning (again) that To a Rocky Moon is available online.
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Oct 12 2011, 06:22 AM
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 316 Joined: 1-October 06 Member No.: 1206 |
Debated whether to add to such an old thread, but I thought this was interesting
http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/caves2011/pdf/8008.pdf Some amazing oblique images new to me at least... P |
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Oct 12 2011, 03:56 PM
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#13
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Administrator Group: Admin Posts: 5172 Joined: 4-August 05 From: Pasadena, CA, USA, Earth Member No.: 454 |
Oh those are very cool. Gotta dig into the data to see if those are available. Here are the numbers of the images from the caption, if anyone else wants to search:
Mare Tranquillitatis pit A: near-nadir image (M126710873R) and B: 7° emission angle image (M155016845R), collectively reveal more than 90 percent of the floor, both images are approximately 175 m wide. C: Oblique view (26° emission angle; M152662021R), a significant portion of the illuminated area is beneath overhanging mare. Layering is revealed in D, E, & F (M155023632R and M144395745L, respectively). -------------------- My website - My Patreon - @elakdawalla on Twitter - Please support unmannedspaceflight.com by donating here.
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Oct 12 2011, 07:47 PM
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#14
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Senior Member Group: Admin Posts: 4763 Joined: 15-March 05 From: Glendale, AZ Member No.: 197 |
M126710873R
http://wms.lroc.asu.edu/lroc/view_lroc/LRO....0/M126710873RE M155016845R http://wms.lroc.asu.edu/lroc/view_lroc/LRO....0/M155016845RC M152662021R http://wms.lroc.asu.edu/lroc/view_lroc/LRO....0/M152662021RC -------------------- If Occam had heard my theory, things would be very different now.
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Apr 17 2014, 11:47 PM
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#15
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Member Group: Members Posts: 316 Joined: 1-October 06 Member No.: 1206 |
More news on lunar pits reported in Icarus:
Distribution, Formation Mechanisms, and Significance of Lunar Pits Original Research Article In Press, Accepted Manuscript, Available online 13 April 2014 Robert V. Wagner, Mark S. Robinson Long story short, there are now 8 known mare pits, 221 Impact melt pits (almost all in Copernican aged craters), and most surprisingly, 2 highland pits! The mare pits are the well known Tranquilitatus, Ingenii and Marius Hills pits, and more recently discovered pits in Lacus Mortis, 2 pits in Mare Fecunditatis, Mare Ingenii, Mare Smythii and the flooded crater Schulter This is based on an automated search algorithm from +50 to -50 lat that is still only 53% complete. So I think we can expect quite a few more discoveries in the future. Although lighting constraints will make it hard near the poles, the fact that we now have 2 highland pits with no obvious formation mechanism means that there could be more! P |
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