Printable Version of Topic

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 6 2006, 11:39 PM

With Spirit starting to get on the move again (even though it's a very small first step), I think that it's high time we got a new topic going and re-invigorate the Spirit thread.

OK. Spirit's moving again after 6 months at Low Ridge.
Here's an animation of the turn (enhanced Front Haz Cam).

File:324k

A big cheer for our little girl at Gusev.
Let's support her with lots of discussion on UMSF.

Astro0

Posted by: mhoward Nov 7 2006, 12:13 AM

Indeed.

Since it's like a whole new mission (albeit one that will be starting slowly), here's the Sol 1010 Navcam mosaic so far...

http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=290273421&size=l

Posted by: jamescanvin Nov 7 2006, 12:16 AM

Great idea.

Looks like this turn was to bring the stuff disturbed by the broken wheel into arms reach. I wonder if we'll see another turn in the next few weeks to get that thin outcropping into reach?

Posted by: climber Nov 7 2006, 08:01 AM

Eppur si muove


**we know Galileo Galilei didn't said that, but it seams appropriate for Spirit

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 7 2006, 10:21 AM

Here is first movement seen through the eyes

of the Left Rear Hazcam on Sol 1010.

jvandriel

Posted by: Ant103 Nov 7 2006, 10:34 AM

"On the road again" good, very good.
I believe that the rover will take his road to McCool Hill, doesn't it?

Posted by: ustrax Nov 7 2006, 10:36 AM

I think it will be back to Home Plate...
Ready to rock!

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 7 2006, 10:48 AM

When Spirit gets back to Homeplate, I think it will be interesting to see if its new instrument, the RFW-TT (ie: the Right Front Wheel - Trenching Tool) will first of all still allow Spirit to still climb up on top, and secondly to see what it uncovers underneath the top layer of HP material as it gets as it gets dragged up the side and across the top of the formation.

Will it uncover anything new? I call for speculation - as so many UMSF'ers are so good at doing.

Astro0

Posted by: climber Nov 7 2006, 12:17 PM

That's a good idea Astro0.
I wonder if the team will actualy use the RFW-TT as a tool. I guess it could be used to move little "flat rocks" to uncover what under looks like; we'll call it RFW-WFR then (With Flat Rock).
Doug, we need a "no longer turning weel" in the Smillies
About speculation, the easiest to think about will be salt, more salt, much more salt

Posted by: fredk Nov 7 2006, 06:19 PM

For the sake of completeness, here's a front hazcam animation showing the full extent of the new movement:

Posted by: mhoward Nov 7 2006, 06:25 PM

It's definite; Steve says in Doug's new interview that they will be going back to Home Plate to explore thoroughly, as soon as the power levels are good enough to get off the north-facing slope. He also says the broken wheel means that our girl can't climb mountains anymore, which is too bad. But I'm sure they'll get as much science out of her as possible, and it will be exciting.

Posted by: Stu Nov 7 2006, 08:48 PM

ONWARDS, SPIRIT.…

One day – next year… next week…
Tomorrow..? – you’ll absently click
Your grubby mice and find one of us died,
Leaving her sister behind, blissfully unaware
She will end her days roving Barsoom’s
Lonely ochre plains alone.

You’ll check all the usual suspect websites,
Refusing to believe that one brutal truth of which
Both of us were so aware: Out There nothing
Is immortal. Beacon-bright stars, even galaxies die; why
Did you convince yourselves a rover could live forever?

But you’ll sit there, staring
At your flat-screens, flatly denying what you’re seeing
With your own wide eyes, crying
“You’re lying!” when reading someone’s mis-spelt
Post announcing “Now there’s only One – “

It will probably not be me.

No, don’t deny it. My faithful friends, this pill cannot
Be sugar-coated. Not now, not after 1000 sols
Of eating this world’s deadly dust and gulping
Down its brittle, cracked-ice air.
Each dawn I see is one closer to my last.
My sols are short, I know that;
These old wheels have only so many
Tortured turns left before they seize,
Freezing solid in the frail duricrust
This frozen-dust covered world calls earth.

But be content! I am not spent yet! The climbing
Sun is warming me again, and as you read these words
The hoarfrost coating my cabled veins thaws!
Soon Homeplate’s layered and ragged raws
will reappear before your eyes…

All I ask is that you walk with me
For I am weary, and my ruined wheel feels
Heavier every sol: the ascent of Husband
Took its toll on me, wounding me
More than I knew. I shall not climb again.

But I am ready to move on. Too long
this rock-strewn ridge has been my home;
The stones scattered at the Columbias’ feet
call out to me again and I would gaze up at their peaks
One more time before I die..

So walk by my side, my friends; walk and talk
To me of the sunsets we have shared
And maybe I will dare to believe you
When you tell me “Your body may die,
But your Spirit will live forever…”

© Stuart Atkinson 2006

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 7 2006, 09:49 PM

Stu,
I hope the guys and girls at SPIRIT mission control read your verse.
They have stuck with their girl throughout the winter and probably feel as cold as she does.
I'm sure that if they read your words they will feel as heart-warmed as I did.

Good stuff.
Astro0

PS: When is Stu's Book of Martian verse coming out?

Posted by: dilo Nov 7 2006, 10:12 PM

Beautiful and inspiring verse, Stu!

Posted by: Stu Nov 7 2006, 10:36 PM

Me too! I've tried a few times to find out if any of them have... and if they have seen the pictures artists like you make... but no success. I know Steve S has read a couple of them cos I've sent him them directly, and he said he liked them, but as for a wider audience within JPL, well, no idea...

As long as people here like them, I'm happy

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 8 2006, 02:37 AM

"Do the teams and JPL'ers see what we do?"
I'd say that the answer is yes.

Just yesterday we had some people from JPL people visiting and they had a Powerpoint presentation which used an image I did of the Canberra DSN station superimposed with Victoria Crater.
Apparently, it's been doing the rounds at JPL and was emailed from one person to the next.
I'm told the trail leads back to SS. If so, that's cool

So Stu, if they saw my piccy, I'm sure that they read your verse as well.

Astro0

Posted by: nprev Nov 8 2006, 03:03 AM

Wonderful, Stu...thank you for giving such a lyrical voice to our collective feelings!

I used to write a little bit of poetry long ago. Apologies in advance; I could never approach Stu's level, but feel inspired to try something:


Spirit Comes Home

Ruddy beauty in the dusty sunrise
marvelous rocks, a crimson layer cake of distant secrets
waiting eons for a touch.

She comes slowly, painfully now
the Spirit of an alien species
from a sister world
but this aging lady comes in peace, no invader

See her reach, and tenderly place
her solitary arm
against the strata, no longer alone
in the vast ocher wilderness
now eager to tell its tales to a sympathetic stranger

She calls to us across
the gulf of trackless space
speaking for the voiceless witness
of ancient catastrophes
and, if accident will, the drama of emerging life
cut too short?

Listen to her; she is old and wise
treasure the gems of her declining years
and know that, when what must happen does, she lived
for all of us
and will live on in us all

Posted by: CosmicRocker Nov 8 2006, 05:27 AM

This is fantastic. Not only have we seen the recent movement, but we have heard some insider information from SS himself about future plans. Even if overdue, it was a very well-timed interview, considering recent events at both rovers, and not to mention MRO. I am quite the proverbial "happy camper."

Speaking of Spirit's New Adventure, surely we are all pleased to know HP will be revisited. There is so much there that everyone wants to see. That alone will be quite an adventure. I'll have to confess that I was very pleased to learn that the geological promised land will be next on the agenda. It is sad to note that it took the failed wheel to eliminate the plan to climb McCool, but I just didn't see a lot of value in stuggling to the top of another hill that is likely to display more variants of the rocks seen on the last hill.

It will still be difficult with the bad wheel, but it seems a better idea to look for something new and different along a traverse with less elevation change. Those badlands are what I would like to see in more detail, even if they cannot be climbed.

One of the things that really amazes me is that these rovers seem to be capable of surprising us more after 1000 sols than they were on sol 1.

Posted by: djellison Nov 8 2006, 08:05 AM

1000 Sols have come and gone,
Yet memories still linger.
Spirit is about to move
I hope she pulls out a finger.


Doug

Posted by: climber Nov 8 2006, 09:24 AM

Was looking for Stu’s verses,
About loved rovers,
I hit a key to log,
Find a poem from Doug!

Posted by: Phil Stooke Nov 8 2006, 04:26 PM

Oppo got stuck in a ripple,
And Spirit turned into a cripple,
But the folks at the Lab
Got them out of rehab,
I think they're deserving a tipple.

Anon

Posted by: lyford Nov 8 2006, 05:21 PM

Oh, I don't know - maybe it's the curmudgeon in me, but imagine Spirit being a little cranky after such a long nap. She is the more http://www.astrobio.net/news/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=1583&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0of the two, even according to http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/opportunity_hopes_030626.html If I were an old rover with a gimpy wheel and a sibling who seems to get all the luck and headlines, I might have more of a reaction like this from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Race upon being awoken after a nice relaxing break:

 risenshn.wav ( 100.8K ) : 657

1000 sols! All in a row! Who knew it was possible?

Great poetry work all, especially that Anonymous person. He (or she) sure is prolific.

Posted by: ToSeek Nov 8 2006, 07:41 PM

Squyres talks http://space.com/missionlaunches/061106_mars_update.html about some "etched terrain" off to the southwest being the next stop after Home Plate and vicinity. Can anyone point out just what he's talking about? Thanks.

Posted by: climber Nov 8 2006, 09:09 PM

This is "important" thing to think about.
I'm sure all of us, UMSF'ers, would like to contribute in some way to the rovers exploration. I'm sure we do. From Tesheiner's route to James' MMB, from "The Imaging team whose work is published time to time" to Doug's management, from Stu's verse to Shaka humour, etc, etc, etc, (sorry for others) I'm sure all of us contribute to the success of the mission. I guess the reputation, the quality, the dedication of this forum is known inside teh JPL... and other agencies. Stu's get the point when he says that he writes verses for this forum at first but he's proud to know that JPL insiders actualy read it.
On another end, I'll be currious to know how they keep an eye on the more scientific part of the forum, mainly the geologic talks. They know by now that some people here are REAL geologists who can understand what they see, can fomulate hypothesis that others will challenge. I cannot imagine that some of "ours" hypothesis have not been considered seriously by Mer's team.
Lets face it guys, were' part of the Team.

Posted by: Stu Nov 8 2006, 11:17 PM

Go get 'em Spirit...!

“Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known.” - Carl Sagan

Posted by: Sunspot Nov 9 2006, 12:49 AM

Have a look at this fullsize pic: http://www.msss.com/moc_gallery/r16_r21/images/R20/R2001024.html

If you scroll down the the image there's a sort of "wrinkly" area (above and to the right of the large crater) I think that is the area he's referring to.

Posted by: centsworth_II Nov 9 2006, 03:45 AM

To me that wrinkly area looks like the remains of an outflow coming from the direction of Home Plate.

Posted by: nprev Nov 9 2006, 05:23 AM

...drool! Wouldn't it be great if....nah, I can't say it.

Anyhow, I was late for the poetry parody party, so here it be:

Dusty discoveries
Glorious golf cart
Roaming rusty roads
Remotely reconning reviled ridges rife with refuse?
REJECT!
Reprogram
Roam reliably, resolutely
Seeking solutions subtle
Throughout tumultuous terrain
Universal, unanimous not Urthbound in the undertaking
Victorious across half a world
With a wink, the Spirit of humanity proudly declares
I am no xenophobe
(Why?)

Posted by: Sunspot Nov 9 2006, 10:02 AM

Also, I think you can see it in Sol 595 PanCam images taken on top of Husband Hill.

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/595/2P179186932EFFAEDNP2282L5M1.HTML.
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/595/2P179187070EFFAEDNP2282R1M1.HTML
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/595/2P179186932EFFAEDNP2282R7M1.HTML

And in the pan released 22nd December 2005

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/panoramas/spirit/2005.html

You can also see large crater:

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/597/2P179365570EFFAEDNP2284R2M1.HTML

Posted by: kungpostyle Nov 9 2006, 03:18 PM

The rippled or winkled terrain to the south seems geologically younger than the plains to me, far fewer craters are visible as compared to the adjacent plains. It also seems collapsed and appears to lie below the level of the plains. I wonder if the loss of whatever caused this surface to collapse (ice?) vented through Home plate?

A poem:

There once was a MER from Nantucket
Who saw a basalt the size of a bucket
She said with a grin, while holding her chin
Since my RAT bits are gone, I'll just buff it.

Posted by: mhoward Nov 9 2006, 03:30 PM

Although I'm enjoying the poetry parody party, I want to chime in and say I found Stu's original poem rather moving... and I'm not usually a big poetry fan. I would definitely buy the book

Perhaps there should also be an anthology of MER poetry by various authors... we are certainly collecting enough examples.

Posted by: stewjack Nov 9 2006, 06:26 PM

Here is an old flicker gif of the rough terrain.

It think that it brings out the fact that it is either depressed or surrounded by a rim. There definitely appears to be a rim or ridge separating the area from the basin. I hope Spirit is not blocked by that feature.

Note I am not geologist, and am just using terms that I am familiar with.

File size 500 Kb

Posted by: Stu Nov 9 2006, 06:42 PM

Thanks for that, really appreciate it. I'm now starting to seriously consider the book thing, especially as I have lots of non MER-related poems too... Maybe a MER poetry book with a part 2 of "Misc" after it... maybe some day...

Posted by: nprev Nov 9 2006, 07:31 PM

I agree; Stu is a very talented writer. Surely epochal events like the journey of the MERs require an artist to give history a voice...

Posted by: dvandorn Nov 10 2006, 03:52 AM

There's a couple of rovers on Mars
That drive a lot slower than cars.
As they crawl millimeters
They aren't world-record beaters --
But their world floats along midst the stars!

-the other Doug

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 10 2006, 12:03 PM

Here is the complete 360 degree panoramic view

taken on Sol 1010 with the R0 navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: Phil Stooke Nov 13 2006, 03:35 AM

"There's a couple of rovers on Mars..."

You can't beat a good limerick! Except maybe with a bad one...

(now I'm trying to make up a bad one)

edit - got it!

A couple of profs at Cornell,
Steve Squyres and young Jimmy Bell,
put two rovers together
that they drove hell-for-leather
with their buddies down at JPL

- uh, I got it from my old chum Anon.

Phil

Posted by: Phil Stooke Nov 13 2006, 03:51 AM

... and in a vain effort to redeem myself, here's a polar version of jvandriel's nice new pan. The streaks on Eldorado show up really well.

Phil

Posted by: dilo Nov 13 2006, 07:34 AM

My Vertical (2.5cm/pixel) and Polar:

Posted by: ToSeek Nov 14 2006, 06:35 PM

Thanks for the response - in a brief search, I couldn't find an image that showed that area.

Posted by: lyford Nov 15 2006, 02:04 AM

OK, this is the Spirit one, a departure from the http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=3257&view=findpost&p=75197. Not quite right on the mix, but maybe I will tweak it sometime later.
I hope Dr. Squyres doesn't mind being guest vocalist.

http://homepage.mac.com/lyford/4umsf/MovingAgain.mp3

I was imagining Spirit waking up to a signal and moving again- and then picturing the front hazcam timelapse movies of the IDD working to the beat. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powerhouse_%28song%29 meets http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vangelis were the influences, not sure if I succeeded.

(Again, admins please move me if this belongs in EVA...)

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 15 2006, 02:23 AM

Lyford, you are a *clink* genius.
Moving Again and Victoria Inspiration are fantastic.

I think that a movie idea I have has just found its soundtrack.

Astro0

Posted by: mhoward Nov 15 2006, 03:30 AM

I want the album. Seriously.

Posted by: CosmicRocker Nov 15 2006, 05:36 AM

lyford: I enjoyed the Victoria piece, but I must grab your new sensation on the bigger pipeline, tomorrow.

I also meant to respond to your question earlier. This is a different, but familiar view of the "Geological Promised Land" from the top of Husband Hill. The first time I heard this name used was by Squyres, in a presentation he made on his book signing tour in Houston. He ascribed its origin to someone else on the team, but I forgot who it was. It has since been mentioned several times in other venues, so one would have to suspect it is an area of interest.

It appears to me to be the kind of terrain we would call "http://www.google.com/search?q=define%3Abadlands" in the western US. Ever since I first saw them I dreamed of visiting them after Home Plate, so I am excited about the possibility of Spirit visiting them. As someone suggested earlier, the intervening ridge could make that difficult. The context image is cropped from a lovely pano that slinted did.

Posted by: jamescanvin Nov 15 2006, 07:02 AM

That's awesome Lyford!

This is was I love about this place, there can't be anywhere else on the web where science, engineering, exploration, fiction, poetry, music, images, sfx, comedy... are produced and discussed so effortlessly side by side and all, as one rover PI might put it, at such an impressively high level.

James

Posted by: dilo Nov 15 2006, 07:04 AM

Agree, I'm without words, it's fantastic!

Posted by: climber Nov 15 2006, 07:05 AM

Can somebody find an exemple of a terrain where Spirit went by that represent the 9° steepness limitation due to the right front weel Steve is speaking about ?

Posted by: ustrax Nov 15 2006, 08:50 AM

Great piece of work lyford!!!
Looks like UMSF has also awake from a conjuction!
Everybody's doing something, giving the best they have...That's just fantastic!!!

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 15 2006, 10:06 AM

Here is the complete panoramic view from Sol 1010.

Taken with the R0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: Stu Nov 15 2006, 10:37 AM

You absolutely did my friend, you absolutely did.

Like many others I'm starting to feel rather humbled by the talent gathered here. We have musicians, geologists, engineers, writers, scientists, map-makers, imagers... Just think about that mix. What does that sound like to you..?

Ladies and gentlemen, I think we should declare ourselves the first true martian settlement.

Seriously, excellent work lyford, very inspiring. I only hope Steve and the rest of the gang get to hear your music. I so often wonder how much of "our stuff" makes it into JPL and into the hallowed Halls of Power. I mean, I know we don't create these musical pieces, images and poems for them, we do it for ourselves and each other primarily, but it would be such a shame if the pages of UMSF were as far as it all went, what with all the time, love and energy everyone puts into their creations. (And no, I;m not forgetting the stunning achievements of images being featured on APOD and aviation magazine covers; I am SO proud of the members behind those pics!) I don't want to email SS directly and ask him how much of our material he sees/hears etc, that would be a bit crass, but I'm genuinely dying to know. Not for any sense of approval or bragging rights, it would just be nice to know that a) our creativity is being enjoyed by the people whose efforts inspired it, and they realise just how important this mission is to people "Out Here" now. I'd love to think that if we went around some of the MER-related centres and labs that we'd find printouts of images created by dilo, horton, nirgal, jvandriel, ant and our other image mages stuck to walls, people listening to lyford's music on headphones while tapping away on keyboards, and maybe one or two people reading my poems while grabbing a coffee between tasks. That would be kinda nice.

Posted by: climber Nov 15 2006, 01:21 PM

Lyford, thank U so much, you're a true DJ (Not Doug Jellison, eh )
Your music is perfectly timed and mixed. Nothing to impROVE

Posted by: lyford Nov 15 2006, 04:42 PM

Thanks for everyone's kind words - I don't aspire to be the poor man's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Planets though perhaps the poor man's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomita doing Gustav Holst.

I may have a few more musical ideas lying around somewhere.... and perhaps some that volcanopele would find more appropriate for inspiration- but that would be another thread.

My theory is that during conjunction we were image starved and forced to draw upon inner talents to get by.... the UMSF Cultural Renaissance! (Not to be confused with Mars Renaissance Orbiter...)

Now - Back to the Rovers!

EDIT - ps - thanks for the link, james!

Posted by: CosmicRocker Nov 16 2006, 06:15 AM

Well, it is difficult for some of us to get "back to the rovers" with the http://www.google.com/search?q=define%3Adearth&btnG=Search of images. I did grab your mp3 today, and I must say, it is amazing. Totally unexpected on this end... The remote communication sounds you used at the beginning and the SS quotes you used throughout the piece were so perfect. I have been playing it over and over again all night in the background. That was a genius piece. It definitely made me feel better after checking the usual sources, and finding nothing new tonight. Thank you, so much.

Posted by: lyford Nov 16 2006, 04:14 PM

Well, that wasn't actual telemetry... probably just an AOL dial up connection from one of my sample sets.

Hmmmm.... actual telemetry.... I wonder.....

Posted by: Myran Nov 16 2006, 09:06 PM

Ok where do I sign up? I'm certainly there in Spirit.

Posted by: alan Nov 17 2006, 04:36 AM

Another move tomorrosol

Posted by: nprev Nov 17 2006, 05:53 AM

Bit late, Lyford, but like wow...that was both inspiring and hella cool!

The amount of sheer talent amongst the members here is astonishing...thanks for allowing a crusty old Air Force sergeant with few relevant skills to experience it all!

Posted by: Indian3000 Nov 17 2006, 09:01 PM

MI Stitch Sol 1017

Context
http://marsrovers.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/f/1017/2F216650695EFFAS07P1110L0M1.JPG

Posted by: alan Nov 18 2006, 04:30 PM

Another turn to the right, now in position to examine the fine layers.

Spirit also caught a cloud above McCool Hill.

Posted by: Indian3000 Nov 18 2006, 10:02 PM

Sol 1022

Posted by: Indian3000 Nov 18 2006, 10:04 PM

vertical 1cm /pix

Posted by: centsworth_II Nov 19 2006, 06:00 PM

Pull up a bit and break me off some of that, Spirit.

Posted by: fredk Nov 19 2006, 06:27 PM

Anyone notice that after the sol 1022 move, we appear to be at a greater tilt than before?

Of course we need to know the orientation of the tilt as well.

I always thought it was a bit odd the way they arrived at Low Ridge Haven way back when - they didn't spend much time trying to wiggle into a position with greater tilt. I guess they had enough.

Posted by: helvick Nov 19 2006, 06:51 PM

[quote name='fredk' date='Nov 19 2006, 06:27 PM' post='75608'I guess they had enough. [/quote]
It was barely enough but I think they were very sure that it actually was enough and there was no point in risking making a mistake that would have put her into a potentially "power negative" situation.

Posted by: jamescanvin Nov 19 2006, 10:28 PM

Yup, according to the rover quaternians on the tracking site (which I'm more confident about, after getting the tilt change right last time ) we are now at 12.55 degrees tilt and angled only 8.5 degrees from north.

James

Posted by: dilo Nov 19 2006, 10:33 PM

Animation of last 3 Sols front hazcam (right):

Posted by: mhoward Nov 19 2006, 10:43 PM

Sol 1022:

http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=301312553&size=l

Posted by: Nirgal Nov 19 2006, 11:12 PM

Good one ! Very nice "movie feeling"
... even with clouds(?) on the clear late winter sky ...

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 20 2006, 11:00 AM

For the last time

here is the complete navcam panorama taken on

Sol 1010 and 1016 with the R0 navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 20 2006, 11:20 AM

Here is my version of the polar view of the Solar Deck.

Taken on Sol 1016 with the R0 navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 21 2006, 10:08 AM

Here is the complete panoramic view taken

by Spirit on Sol 1022 and Sol 1024 with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: Nix Nov 21 2006, 10:41 AM

A QTVR of this latest pan by jvandriel

Nico

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 21 2006, 10:49 AM

Here is a self-portrait of Spirit.

Taken on Sol 1024 with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 21 2006, 10:55 AM

Great movie Nix.

Thanks

jvandriel

Posted by: Nix Nov 21 2006, 12:04 PM

You're welcome..I found your pan to be a nice candidate for qtvr. Since I haven't been able to create much myself lately, I can at least have some fun with other people's work

Nico

Posted by: Stu Nov 21 2006, 12:48 PM

If anyone hasn't done it yet, scroll down to the bottom then just make Spirit spin around and around! You really get the feeling you're hanging in the air above it!

Oh. Okay, just me then...

Great work Nix, as usual.

Posted by: Indian3000 Nov 21 2006, 01:22 PM

spirit self-portrait ... sol 1024

Posted by: Nix Nov 21 2006, 01:27 PM

You do the spin too Stu...

It's very easy to do though, I use http://www.pano2qtvr.com/ regularly with contributors' navcam pans and it does the job in a couple of minutes.

Nico

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 23 2006, 06:42 AM

A great 'end of day' shot from Spirit.
A quick anaglyph.
Enjoy.
Astro0

File:161k

Posted by: Nirgal Nov 23 2006, 02:48 PM

Very Nice !
from which Sol is this from ? (I couldn't find it among the latest exploratorium images)

Posted by: jamescanvin Nov 23 2006, 08:52 PM

Sol 1025

They are there:

http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/pancam/2006-11-22/2P217371670ESFAS20P2578L6M1.JPG
http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/pancam/2006-11-22/2P217371620ESFAS20P2578R1M1.JPG

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 23 2006, 08:56 PM

Spirit Pancam http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/pancam/2006-11-22/2P217371620ESFAS20P2578R1M1.JPG that arrived Nov.22.

BTW - Can't find that handy Timestamp software anymore. Anyone know where it went?

Astro0

EDIT: Just as I post, James comes up with the answer.

Posted by: fredk Nov 24 2006, 12:28 AM

A great shot it is, Astro - only I think you got the left and right channels switched!

Posted by: mhoward Nov 24 2006, 12:39 AM

Sol 1022-1026 Navcam:

http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=304372060&size=l

Posted by: Phil Stooke Nov 24 2006, 02:43 AM

Here's the above pan in polar form.

Phil

Posted by: fredk Nov 24 2006, 03:23 AM

Stunning! I plugged it into FSPViewer and almost fell out of my chair!

Posted by: Astro0 Nov 24 2006, 03:35 AM

fredk,
You're right.
Here's the anaglyph again.
Thanks
Astro0

File:136k

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 24 2006, 09:36 AM

Here is a mosaic of Mi images taken on Sol 1027.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Nov 24 2006, 09:42 AM

and an older one from Sol 1017.

jvandriel

Posted by: Tesheiner Nov 24 2006, 04:15 PM

Blueberries?

Posted by: mhoward Nov 26 2006, 08:06 PM

I just discovered there is a tool for web-viewing equirectangular projections that are hosted on Flickr... somebody on my Flickr page actually pointed it out to me a few weeks ago on my Flickr page but I didn't read it until now. Check it out.

http://fieldofview.com/flickr/?page=photos/marscat/304372060&tags=equirectangular

Pity it doesn't allow zooming in a bit further, but otherwise it looks pretty sharp.

Posted by: Shaka Nov 27 2006, 09:22 PM

Wow, you talk about well-rounded!

These basalt grains must have been reworked for ages to get so perfect.
Even the sands of El Dorado were not so big and beautiful:

Posted by: Sunspot Nov 27 2006, 11:57 PM

Are you sure those are just grains? They look like something else to me...more like the Merdiani blueberries, they're encased in another material.

Posted by: Shaka Nov 28 2006, 12:58 AM

Kowabunga! If those are blueberries, Sunny, you've got a major scoop, and should sit right down and write a paper!
Personally I'm sceptical. They're much smaller than Meridiani concretions and are held together with a minimum of matrix (sulfates?). I think blueberries need a resonable amount of matrix volume around each one to allow room for growth. Also the RAT brush has revealed them as very smooth, shiny and dark. They look more like obsidian than gray hematite - Dam' I wonder if they could be glass spherules from some lava fountain? Nah! Then we would see some irregular droplet or dumbell shapes as well as spheres. Only massive reworking would get them all so round and uniform in size.

Still, they look interesting to me and probably should get a full IDD analysis. Pity we can't grind into them.

Posted by: dvandorn Nov 28 2006, 06:22 AM

I'll also point out that a somewhat similar strata over by Home Plate read out to be quite basaltic, in keeping with the chemistry of the plains basalts. I'd like to think otherwise, but I betcha these "berries" turn out to be basaltic in content, as well.

-the other Doug

Posted by: Marz Nov 28 2006, 04:21 PM

I also thought they might be obsidian beads, especially considering the idea that homeplate is a relic from explosive volcanism. But it's strange they'd be so concentrated in one layer, and as you mentioned, shouldn't flying through the air shape them more like drops? Could thin martian air not provide enough friction to make them look like earth's analogues?

Good stuff!

Posted by: centsworth_II Nov 28 2006, 04:32 PM

I'm not ready to jump on the berry bandwagon but... if berries, we are not necessarily seeing them in the matrix in which they formed. They could be free berries cemented together. Also, I remember seeing smooth, shiny berries in a trench dug by Opportunity in Eagle crater.

Posted by: Nirgal Nov 28 2006, 10:29 PM

Thanks, james.

of course I couldn't resist this one:

Posted by: CosmicRocker Nov 29 2006, 06:24 AM

If you are talking about the lower, coarser-grained unit at Home Plate, I completely agree with you. Spirit observed this unit with the MI on sols 747 and 750.
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/spirit_m747.html
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/spirit_m750.html

This new layer seems to show more of the spherules, but I would have to guess this rock is closely related to the unit at the base of HP. The geologic context here is very different from that at Meridiani. The resemblance of these spherules to the berry concretions is only superficial. Coincidentally, SS mentioned the spherules in that lower unit recently in the CEPSAR lecture that DeChengst so kindly made available as an avi file. Shortly after 26:20 he said: "...you can sort of convince yourself that they're reminiscent of lapilli, perhaps." Be sure to note that he said "sort of," and "perhaps." Lapilli, or some lapilli-like clasts would fit better into the geologic context of this environment, which is thought to be energetic...explosive volcanism or explosive impacts, or such.

Posted by: dilo Nov 29 2006, 07:12 AM

I was waiting for this, Bernhard!

Posted by: dilo Dec 1 2006, 10:47 PM

Incredible rock in the MI field on Sol 1035...

This is an "artistic" composition of 3 frames at slightly different distances (nothing scientific, guys!).
It strongly recall a red fruit but I do not know english name. In Italy we call it "http://www.agraria.org/coltivazioniarboree/melograno.htm" (Punica granatum).

Posted by: djellison Dec 1 2006, 10:57 PM

pomegranate

Doug

Posted by: nprev Dec 2 2006, 01:40 AM

Anybody know if they're planning a TES integration on "The Pomegranate"? (Come to that, is Spirit's TES still operational?)

Posted by: jamescanvin Dec 2 2006, 01:45 AM

Driving again on sol 1037!

Posted by: mhoward Dec 3 2006, 11:10 PM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/marscat/313343709/

Posted by: Stu Dec 4 2006, 06:19 PM

From the latest MER Status Report...

Sol 1023 (Nov. 28): The panoramic camera took images of targets "El
Dorado" and "Prat" as well as thumbnail images of the sky. ..

"Prat"? sigh... that poor, poor rock. I know it's probably been named to honour some scientist, but someone should have told the MER guys what a "prat" is over here in England... would have saved that little rock a very hard time when it's older...

Posted by: tedstryk Dec 5 2006, 12:28 AM

Perhaps the rock has a crack in it.

Posted by: jamescanvin Dec 5 2006, 12:38 AM

Here is poor Prat - doesn't look like one.

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/1023/2P217179010EFFAS20P2556L7M1.HTML

Posted by: Stu Dec 5 2006, 12:58 AM

Just goes to show that beneath the surface of every poor prat there's a complicated creature with lots of hidden layers...

Posted by: Ant103 Dec 5 2006, 08:46 AM

And Prat in colors
http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Spirit/Images_en_couleur/FinesStrates-Sol1023.JPG

Posted by: jvandriel Dec 5 2006, 10:09 AM

Here is the complete 360 degree panoramic view

taken on Sol 1037 with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Dec 5 2006, 10:45 AM

and a polar view from Sol 1037.

jvandriel

Posted by: Myran Dec 5 2006, 11:32 AM

Lot of layers, yes thats the word Stu. That port prat doesnt even have the looks for this neighborhood - while it sits there falling to pieces it looks quite more like a runaway from Meridiani.

Posted by: fredk Dec 5 2006, 08:51 PM

From http://planetary.org/news/2006/1130_Mars_Exploration_Rovers_Update_Spirit.html

"...then heading back to Home Plate, the formation that science team members believe may be the remnant of an explosive volcano. After that, the rover may head southeast, lured by a bounty of new unusual rocks and formations the MER team can see in an image recently sent down from" MRO.

And

"If Spirit does head southeast from Home Plate, to some of the intriguing targets now visible in the HiRISE image, that means it will be going in the opposite direction of McCool Hill, where the team initially had planned for it to spend its second Martian winter."

Obviously an error here - McCool Hill is southeast from Home Plate!

There's certainly interesting stuff in all directions, but do people wish to speculate where would be most interesting to go after Home Plate now that we all can see the hirise image?

Posted by: jamescanvin Dec 5 2006, 11:46 PM

Kind of a watershed moment with tosols drive (1039), Spirit has lost her north tilt, we have left the 'haven'.

James

Posted by: hugh Dec 6 2006, 06:03 AM

Von Braun looks like it would be the next interesting feature going southwest, and pancams from its base should be spectacular even if the rover can't climb up to its "cap".

Posted by: Sunspot Dec 6 2006, 01:48 PM

Can anyone who downloaded the full size image of Spirits landing site post a crop of the terrain just to the south of the Columbia Hills that Spirit might visit after returning to Homeplate? Thanks

Posted by: alan Dec 6 2006, 02:54 PM

James posted a small section of the 'promised land' here
http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=3555&view=findpost&p=76795

Posted by: Pertinax Dec 6 2006, 05:38 PM

I'm excited to see that Spirit may head off to the southeast after HP (and hopefully VonBraun as well). Looking at the last crop Emily posted containing Spirit's current position and the sand-trap she fell ill in, eastward and just on the other side of the sand-trap is another 'strikingly' circular feature (the one Korolev and Faget are part of) that seems to be one of the more interesting accessible features (and now with better imagery to navigate around the "obvious" sand-traps. A relative of HP, impact, or other. If this feature is indeed what is interesting the folks at JPL, it will be exciting to see.

Nothing new and mars-shattering I know, but interesting. Any thoughts?




-- Pertinax

Posted by: Marz Dec 6 2006, 10:06 PM

Watershed might be a prophetic word to describe the latest MI picture from Spirit!

Is this a sign of liquid water on Mars... more specifically, a drop of water that has refrozen? (look at the left center of this image)

http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/micro_imager/2006-12-06/2M215673168EFFAS00P2979M2M1.JPG

Could this be a drop of oil lube from Spirit's arm, or melted frost on the arm that trickled down and dropped, or something completely different? I don't think it's a camera artifact, since the drop has displaced dust on the surface.

Posted by: fredk Dec 6 2006, 10:25 PM

We've had similar views before. I think the drops are adhesives used in the construction.

Posted by: deglr6328 Dec 6 2006, 10:40 PM

I know the gully/water news is exciting but let's don't go crazy kids. They http://marsrover.nasa.gov/gallery/press/spirit/20050125a.html just epoxy adhesive and solder weld dots on the panel joints.

Posted by: Steve Dec 6 2006, 11:58 PM

Thanks for the link; here's an enhanced version of the image on that page for comparison.

The drops were there on sol 350.

Steve

Posted by: Marz Dec 7 2006, 02:27 AM

Ack! I'm so embarrassed! I remember those epoxy drops now, but when viewing the MI today I just tricked myself into thinking it overlayed dust grains. Sorry for the false alarm.

Posted by: jvandriel Dec 7 2006, 09:31 AM

Here is the 360 degree panoramic view taken on Sol 1039

with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: Phil Stooke Dec 8 2006, 03:00 PM

Here is jvandriel's latest pan in polar format.

Phil

Posted by: Sunspot Dec 14 2006, 12:01 AM

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/spirit/20061213a.html

Data from the rover's Mössbauer spectrometer provides evidence that they have an enhanced amount of the mineral hematite relative to surrounding soils.

Posted by: Greg Hullender Dec 14 2006, 04:51 AM

My gosh, how long does an integration take now? I seem to remember that the radioisotope that drives the spectrometer had only a 90-day halflife, so it would seem to need 1000x more time than it used to.

Or did they do this one integration all during the winter? :-)

--Greg

Posted by: djellison Dec 14 2006, 07:26 AM

It's actually more like 200-and-something days.... so we're looking at integrations of 4 days instead of 12 hours.

Doug

Posted by: ustrax Dec 14 2006, 02:28 PM

http://space.com/news/061213_ap_mars_moon.html

Posted by: vikingmars Dec 14 2006, 03:03 PM

I think they think of this image (clouds in upper right corner)
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/r/1037/2R218432359EFFAS42P1312R0M1.JPG

Posted by: Tesheiner Dec 15 2006, 12:18 PM

I haven't seen here any panorama from sol 1041, so I'll post mine.

I used it (actually a polar version) to refine the http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=44&view=findpost&p=77664 on the route map. I find the correlation between the ground image (rover's navcam) and the orbital one (HiRISE) is so good that I made this picture below matching some rocks on both images. I could continue matching other rocks but those are more then enough! The

... and the current rover's position is quite obvious.



Edited: The scale for the HiRISE image background is 3.33 cm/pix.

Posted by: RobertEB Dec 15 2006, 01:49 PM

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/spirit/20061213a.html

Posted by: Shaka Dec 15 2006, 07:55 PM

Good question! What does "enhanced hematite" translate to re the concentrations in blueberries (which could be well over 50%)? Have any of the Meridiani concretions shown the glossy surface that is apparent on King George granules - before or after RAT brushing? I assumed that these granules were reworked but chemically unaltered basaltic sand. If they are more akin to blueberries, the theorists will have a field day working out a microcosm of Meridiani evaporite sandstone diagenesis here in this little corner of Gusev Crater. I wish them luck!

Posted by: helvick Dec 15 2006, 08:05 PM

Wow. I know that I have to stop being amazed by the quality of the HiRISE imagery at some stage but the fact that you can do this is astonishing. Those really are pretty small rocks. Wow.

Posted by: Indian3000 Dec 15 2006, 09:03 PM

HiRis Simulation for sol 1041 with Tesheiner's Map

Posted by: Julius Dec 15 2006, 09:38 PM

It is amazing that Spirit has now found blueberries in Gusev,very similar to the ones covering most of Meridiani on the other side of the planet.The haematite rich berries in Gusev most likely to have formed(I presume) from volcanic activity .Would this make scientists rethink the source of the haematite in Meridiani.Is the haematite water related or volcanic in origin?It seems that with the new opportunity findings of bigger sized blueberries around Victoria are making scientists having second thoughts as to the role of subsurface or surface or if any water playing a role in the formation of haematite??Would you agree that haematite in gusev is more likely to be volcanic in origin or is it a clue to the watery past of Gusev basin?

Posted by: centsworth_II Dec 16 2006, 07:16 AM

From sol25, in a wheel-dug trench, so no brushing. http://marsrovers.nasa.gov/gallery/all/opportunity_m025.html

Posted by: jvandriel Dec 16 2006, 02:11 PM

Here is the 360 degree panoramic view taken by Spirit

with the L0 Navcam on Sol 1041.

jvandriel

Posted by: Phil Stooke Dec 16 2006, 02:55 PM

Here's a Sol 1041 polar derived from Tesheiner's version of the panorama.

Phil

Posted by: Floyd Dec 16 2006, 03:38 PM

Can someone point out Esperanza, our next target, on one of the maps/pictures? Thanks

Posted by: Pando Dec 17 2006, 05:32 AM

It's probably this one (in front):

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/n/1022/2N217095578EFFAS20P0740R0M1.JPG

Posted by: Phil Stooke Dec 17 2006, 02:47 PM

http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/mro/gallery/press/20061213a/PIA09091-RA5-bear-berkner-george-islands_annotated_br2.jpg

Phil

Posted by: Phil Stooke Dec 17 2006, 03:17 PM

I hadn't noticed before, but the new HiRISE image makes the Faget-Korolev area look like a second Home Plate, half buried under the flanks of McCool Hill. If Home Plate is the site of an explosive eruption (magma encountering ground ice as it nears the surface, as seems to be the picture now), there might have been several places where this happened. Maybe Goddard (just south of this image) is another smaller vent... have we stumbled on a field of small volcanoes? That would be quite a finding in itself for Spirit (the interpretation relies on Spirit data, not HiRISE).

Phil

Posted by: Myran Dec 17 2006, 03:49 PM

Yes I do think Goddard are another feature of the same kind, and in images from MGS there seems to be yet another fourth one also - I have to give a good look of new hirise imagery for this area.

But the idea that ground ice have been found here at one point would not suprise me the slightest, theres some parts in the area that look eerily similar to places I know of on Earth which have been grinded by not only one but several ice ages.

As for Julius question, there are already one alternative theory for the creation of the hematite in Meridiani also. Personally I dont think it will stand up expecially well, blueberries found there originates in the bedrock which have a wet origin. (Even though many have eroded out of same bedrock)

Its good to have many competing theories though, for some it is confusing but personally I start to worry when someone claim it have to be this way or that. Its better when you have the question 'Are we looking at this in the right way.'
We know Gusev have been wet at one point, images from orbit show that, the area have later been pelted by volcanic rocks from eruptions that happened quite some distance away and covered most but not all - we might have seen a few samples of the rocks from the 'wet' period and one or two of those were really odd.

Posted by: fredk Dec 17 2006, 05:44 PM

"Mini homeplate" just south of Eldorado. We passed by fairly close to it on our drive but I believe it was hidden behind a ridge.

Posted by: Myran Dec 17 2006, 06:37 PM

Yes I remember it was discussed back then and if we could see it or not at the time.
Having looked at the medium resolution image (the 1.2 GB are out of question for me sadly)
The one east of Homeplate got one arrow, then I feel somewhat less certain but still havnt ruled out the southern one might be another here its pointed out with one arrow though.

I added one arrow with a question mark for yet another feature even further to the southeast that very well just can be one imposter 'Homeplate look-alike'.

Posted by: Tesheiner Dec 18 2006, 03:03 PM

I wasn't aware of that press release. I was looking to the pancams and navcams searching for any imaging sequence which include Esperanza but with no luck.

BTW, sol 1051 was driving day and it looks Spirit is finally there. Esperanza within the IDD work volume.
http://nasa.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/forward_hazcam/2006-12-17/2F219669933EFFASAFP1214R0M1.JPG

Posted by: Ant103 Dec 18 2006, 03:15 PM

Winter's vestiges :

http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Spirit/Panoramas_couleur/VestigesHivernaux-Sol1042-1045.jpg

This is the place of the work volume of Spirit during the winter.

Posted by: RobertEB Dec 18 2006, 04:14 PM

Perhaps this King George rock was blasted here by an impactor from elsewhere on the planet? (I believe that is what Bounce Rock is).

If not. If King George formed where Spirit found it, then it still could have a watery origin. Don’t forget, the main reason Spirit is here is because Gusev is believe to have contained a lake at one time.

Side note: Up close, the Spirit Blueberries do resemble the Opportunity Blueberries. They have that same nice sheen to them.

Posted by: ElkGroveDan Dec 18 2006, 04:29 PM

I just love the color balance of that image. I know it's not true, but neither is it the standard "false" color with screaming blues throughout. It has a very earthly quality, that makes it comfortable to view and digest.

Posted by: RobertEB Dec 18 2006, 04:41 PM

Scratch King George Island being a rock blasted by an impactor. After looking at the picture above, it appears to be a layer of rock. I would put my money on it being formed in a shallow lake simular to those rocks Opportunity found.

Posted by: Julius Dec 18 2006, 07:06 PM

But what is King George made up of?Is it Basalt rock or just a handful of iron berries?

Posted by: Shaka Dec 18 2006, 09:29 PM

Presumably the MER team has the spectrometry to make that distinction, but has not yet announced it.

Gotta get back to the ISS on NASA TV. I'm helping "Beamer" fix the damn guide wire on the solar array.
Spine-tingling tension!

PS to Ant: Nice stitch, Ant!

Posted by: CosmicRocker Dec 19 2006, 08:35 AM

Shucks... good luck with that, Shaka. I watched part of it, but eventually moved to another channel. I hope it all worked out in the end. Right, the spectrometry seems to be the piece we only have part of.

I love it, EGD. "Screaming blues..." Who would ever have guessed that would be a plague on Mars.

Regarding the round things bearing some hematite, all round things on Mars are probably not tasty berries.

Posted by: Pando Dec 19 2006, 06:06 PM

Hey Shaka, you should've used a finger, not a can of spray paint...

Posted by: dilo Dec 20 2006, 06:41 AM

I do not know the name of this target rock (some help please!)... anyway this is a stitch from Sol1053 imagery:

Posted by: Tesheiner Dec 20 2006, 09:32 AM

That's Esperanza.

There are some related posts on page #10 (if you use the forum's default settings) of this same thread.

Posted by: Ant103 Dec 20 2006, 04:51 PM

"Winter's vestiges" is updated :
http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Images_de_spirit-2006.html#Sol1042

(you can see that my second version is less sature and less deform by the sttiching process)

Posted by: dilo Dec 20 2006, 11:01 PM

Thanks, Tesheiner. "Hope" in spanish, I think is a good name...

Posted by: jvandriel Dec 23 2006, 02:16 PM

A little late because I am working again

but here is the panoramic view taken on Sol 1051 and 1052 with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Dec 23 2006, 04:01 PM

Here is my version of Esperanza.

Taken on Sol 1053 with the Mi cam.

jvandriel

Posted by: Ant103 Dec 25 2006, 02:44 PM

Hi


Image from the Sol 1025.

Posted by: Bob Shaw Dec 25 2006, 03:00 PM

Phil:

I agree; HP is more likely toi be understood if it's simply a particularly good example of a process which happened across the whole locality, rather than being a one-off. Rarities do happen, but common causes are far more common, and require no special pleading.

Bob Shaw

Posted by: Shaka Dec 28 2006, 07:04 AM

A Simple, Straightforward, Non-Rhetorical Question for Spirit:

Is This the same as That the same as King George Island?

N.B. This is not referring to the vesicular basalt.

Posted by: Floyd Dec 28 2006, 12:40 PM

We should have images at 13 wavelengths. Do they match?

Posted by: hortonheardawho Dec 28 2006, 02:37 PM

Er, the sol 1060 sequence is a super resolution sequence of this rock:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hortonheardawho/336192679/

An earlier super resolution of the same rock was taken on sol 1002:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hortonheardawho/336192631/


And the McMurdo pan image of sol 904:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hortonheardawho/336192592/

There appears to be some interest in this rock. Why not just crawl over to it?

Posted by: Tesheiner Dec 29 2006, 06:37 PM

It looks Spirit left Low Winter Haven for good on sol 1062!


http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/forward_hazcam/2006-12-29/2F220646051EFFASB7P1212R0M1.JPG

Now it's time to continue exploring Home Plate.

Posted by: mhoward Jan 1 2007, 04:01 AM

Not so fast, I'm afraid...

http://planetary.org/news/2006/1231_Mars_Exploration_Rovers_Update_Spirit.html



Let's hope things get better in the new year...

Posted by: Stu Jan 1 2007, 01:43 PM

(Terran!) New Year's Day view...

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 3 2007, 06:32 PM

Here is the L0 Navcam view taken on Sol 1062.

jvandriel

Posted by: Astro0 Jan 3 2007, 09:30 PM

HAPPY ANNIVERSARY SPIRIT!

3 Earth Years on

Keep rolling

Astro0

Posted by: alan Jan 3 2007, 09:51 PM

Mars Rover photo contest
http://marsdata1.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/photoContest/index.cfm

also on MER site:

Posted by: climber Jan 4 2007, 12:02 AM

Sometimes, misunderstanding prove to be good.
I guess somebody asked for a 3 months mission and the ones that built up the rovers understood 3 YEARS!
Happy Anniversary my dear Spirit...

Posted by: Stu Jan 6 2007, 03:05 PM

Would you like salt with that..?

Posted by: PhilCo126 Jan 6 2007, 05:16 PM

Stu, that photo shows great detail, do You have the NASA photo-number for it ( PIA-something ) ?

Posted by: Stu Jan 6 2007, 05:29 PM

Hey, I made it out of three of the latest Exploratorium Pancam releases, today. L4,5&6.

Here are the linumbers of the three frames...

2P221262924EFFASB7P2..> 05-Jan-2007 11:35 269k
2P221262957EFFASB7P2..> 05-Jan-2007 11:35 246k
2P221262987EFFASB7P2..> 05-Jan-2007 11:35 230k

Posted by: Shaka Jan 6 2007, 08:01 PM

Questions: Is the smear of the dragging wheel recently made or from last year before the winter.
If the latter, do we have a similar foto taken when it was fresh for comparison?
Do the fotos show changes indicative of aging of the surface?

Answer: I questioned (post #165) whether the King George Island collection of cemented spherules was commonly characteristic of the exposed friable-looking layers. The recent MIs of a Ratted layer (don't know the name) http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/micro_imager/2007-01-06/2M221356551EFFASCGP2957M2M1.JPG
show no spherules at all. Guess that answers that question. King George is different; wish I knew what it was.

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 7 2007, 10:08 AM

Here is a mosaic of 2 images made by the Left and Right Navcam

on Sol 1069.

jvandriel

Posted by: mhoward Jan 7 2007, 07:14 PM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/marscat/349301268/

Posted by: mhoward Jan 7 2007, 09:39 PM

Sol 1071 Navcam equirectangular:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/marscat/349486146/

Posted by: djellison Jan 7 2007, 09:55 PM

Given the polo treatment :

Posted by: hortonheardawho Jan 8 2007, 03:51 AM

colorized panorama of target Montalva RAT brush:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hortonheardawho/348114825/

There are image note links to colorized 3D -- and a comments link to a before / after animation.

Posted by: CosmicRocker Jan 8 2007, 04:16 AM

Darn, hortonheardawho...That's beautiful.

Posted by: Shaka Jan 8 2007, 04:16 AM

Looks like your avatar rotated 180 deg. (with a droopy trunk)
How about a mineralogical comparison, Hort?

P.S. I can see the spherule-packed "peanut brittle" off to the left. What's the story here? I feel we're seeing pages from an action-packed suspense thriller. Who can read it to the rest of us?

Posted by: ustrax Jan 8 2007, 02:32 PM

no words to describe that...

Posted by: Ant103 Jan 8 2007, 06:26 PM

It will be hard to post my own version after the beautiful picture of hortonhardawho

But, I try ...

http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Images_de_spirit-2007.html#Sol1070


And the result of a little investigate about the opacity of the atmosphere :

We see clearly that dust quantity is rising. The jpl say that is due to a dust storm around the south pole.

Posted by: FIN Mars Jan 8 2007, 06:58 PM

But what about possible meteorite?
I hope, that spirit drives to near possible meteorite.
http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=176530009&context=set-72157594179653864&size=l
do you can now say, is it meteorite, or know Nasa it?

Posted by: Ant103 Jan 9 2007, 10:40 AM

Here is a more complete version of the evolution of sky opacity from Sol 970 to Sol 1061.

Posted by: Ant103 Jan 9 2007, 04:43 PM

I've made a ultra high contrast desatured version to put in evidence the dust evolution. At the last sol, we can view a little inversion phenomena, like during a dust storm (remember Vikings pictures...) :

Posted by: Gray Jan 9 2007, 06:07 PM

Ant,
Very impressive images. The difference between sol 1041 and 1064 is particularly striking.
Thanks.

Posted by: hortonheardawho Jan 10 2007, 08:22 PM

Post #183 has been updated with all the colorized 3D pairs -- and a colorized 3D panorama and a 3D color pancam context image.

Posted by: jamescanvin Jan 12 2007, 03:25 AM

Looks like we're about to enter another transit season.

Posted by: climber Jan 12 2007, 07:27 AM

Do you know if transit observations generaly would help assessing if the dust is still there in the atmosphere or if this "transit_tau" is just a coincidence?

Posted by: jamescanvin Jan 12 2007, 08:08 AM

I guess we'll find out soon but I suspect that the routines they have for getting tau from the sun images would be messed up a bit with a transit in progress. I think that observation will be of the full sun either just before or after the transit. A 'while the pancam is pointing at the sun anyway might as well slip in a tau' observation.

James

Posted by: djellison Jan 12 2007, 08:52 AM

Bingo - it'll either be "take a tau, then watch a transit" orrrr the other way around.

Now I've got to start convincing the team to do a Hazcam movie during a good Phobos transit to see the terrain 'dim'.

Doug

Posted by: helvick Jan 12 2007, 10:57 AM

Assuming this is a full transit then there would be arund a 40% reduction in light so the dimming in a Hazcam movie would probably be very obvious but even though it would be quite cool to see I'm at a loss as to what scientific merit it would have at all.

Posted by: djellison Jan 12 2007, 11:54 AM

It's a discussion JB and I have after the last round of transits when they managed to get 4 sec-per-frame shooting of one of them. Purely for cool factor.

From the top of Husband hill looking west or east you might see the darkening moving - but from where we are now it's simply a case of cool factor. downsample them to 512 x 512 - compress them hard - get 12 into the budget of a single normal FHAZ frame and make a movie

Doug

Posted by: Airbag Jan 12 2007, 05:37 PM

Problem is, the effect might be almost impossible to see on the "raw" streched images - any dimming will be counteracted by increased stretching perhaps. Depends on stretching algorithm, of course. Presumably we'd see lower contrast with the shadowed areas either way.

Airbag

Posted by: djellison Jan 12 2007, 07:49 PM

Oh - impossible on the raw....but very visible with calibrated imagery

Doug

Posted by: fredk Jan 14 2007, 12:24 AM

From the latest http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/status_spiritAll.html#sol1070

Does anyone know what the temporal resolution or sampling rate of miniTES is? Could it be better than pancam and so better resolve the brief transit?

Posted by: climber Jan 14 2007, 06:08 AM

Another weird idea about the eclipse. Instead of taking a movie of the scenary around, can Spirit take the IDD's shadow before during and after pending it's in the correct position? Any benefit of that?

Posted by: djellison Jan 14 2007, 10:15 AM

It's not really about benefit - it's about cool factor...little else really

Doug

Posted by: alan Jan 15 2007, 04:44 AM

Lots of new super resolution images posted at the Pancam site
http://marswatch.astro.cornell.edu/pancam_instrument/superres.html

Posted by: Ant103 Jan 15 2007, 11:01 AM

Hu hu hu hu !

Posted by: Gray Jan 15 2007, 05:09 PM

Amazing !!!!

Posted by: zoost Jan 17 2007, 01:34 PM

Any ideas what formed the tiny http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/micro_imager/2007-01-16/2M222243353EFFASCGP2939M2M1.jpg like features on the top of the accretionary lapilli?

Posted by: Tesheiner Jan 17 2007, 01:40 PM

Dust/sand grains or ...?

It would be nice to see another MI at a different illumination angle.

Posted by: CosmicRocker Jan 18 2007, 04:11 AM

They really do convincingly appear more like lapilli all the time, don't they.

As for the spaghetti-like things, there are http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/micro_imager/2007-01-16/2M222243030EFFASCGP2939M2M1.JPG of the same area with different illumination. The shadowed version is somewhat suggestive of a dust layer adhering to the underside of the layer, but I suppose it could be other things, like remnants of a lower layer of angular clasts, a weathering rind, or a salt deposit. Curious...

Posted by: nprev Jan 18 2007, 04:43 AM

Can the TES derive any meaningful information about the "spaghetti's" composition from such a limited (in terms of surface area) sample? Seems as if there's a lot of interesting questions with regard to Martian minerology here that are worth investigating (esp. the influence/effects of atmospheric characteristics vs. mafic influences).

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 18 2007, 08:25 PM

The Pancam L2 view on Sol 1081.

jvandriel

Posted by: atomoid Jan 18 2007, 10:43 PM

aside from the spaghetti on http://mars.lyle.org/imagery/2M222243353EFFASCGP2939M2M1.JPG.html, which i nterpret as dust clumping like rime ice, im intrigued by the bright speck at lower right, some sort of crystal facet reflecting the sunshine? the http://mars.lyle.org/imagery/2M222243464EFFASCGP2956M2M1.JPG.html only show a somewhat uninspiring out of focus speck in the same place.

How come we havent seen any crystals in the sediments so far (or have we?), seems the conditions should have allowed some crystal growth, but maybe they are just salt crystals and dont weather very well..

Posted by: CosmicRocker Jan 19 2007, 07:53 PM

I have seen quite a few bright specs in images from both rovers, and have also wondered if at least some of them were flashes from crystal faces. Most of them are too small to determine what they are, but occasionally there have been larger areas that resembled specular reflections to me. The one that comes to mind at the moment is Bounce Rock. Some images of it seemed to display a lot of specular reflections, but I can imagine it may be simply a saturated exposure.


As for seeing crystals of any kind, I think we've seen several examples, though not as commonly as I would have expected. I think I have seen crystal shapes or cross sections in quite a few of the rocks Spirit has looked at with the MI. Opportunity did catch at least a few images of crystals surrounding some concretions (upper right in this: http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040302a/18-jg-04-mi3-halo-B038R1_br.jpg), and there were the hopper crystal outlines seen at Lemon Rind.

Posted by: Stu Jan 19 2007, 09:30 PM

First time I've tried this...

("Fast Show" voice: "Isn't Ultreya BRILLIANT???!"

Some lovely layered rocks here too...

Posted by: atomoid Jan 20 2007, 12:05 AM

The vugs are found aplenty in the weatherd rocks, but i was hoping to see some remaining crystals, although i guess they'd likely all be salt crystals of some sort and would be long gone, unless we could do some ground breaking to find unweatherd ones. as for other crystal types that might last longer, i guess we have to look somewhere else...

Nice picture of bounce, i didnt remember noting what looks like a some soil and blueberries in a depression on top of it, so now how did the bloobs get up there??

Posted by: fredk Jan 20 2007, 12:12 AM

More exciting astro-astronomy plans from the latest http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/status_spiritAll.html#sol1079

Does anyone have access to software that can show us the sky from Mars? What will the elongation of McNaught be that morning?

Posted by: slinted Jan 20 2007, 12:34 AM

http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/horizons.cgi puts the Sun-Observer-Target angle at slightly below 10 degrees for sunrise on sol 1083. Thankfully, the lower dust levels will give a clearer view at sunrise than we would have seen last week. This should be very cool!

Posted by: mhoward Jan 20 2007, 03:38 AM

Some http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/pancam/2007-01-19/2P222482233EFFASCGP2673L7M1.JPG came down, taken about 5 am local Mars time on Sol 1083, facing east. I don't see the comet, though.

Maybe Oppy will have better luck?

Posted by: fredk Jan 20 2007, 04:49 AM

Thanks for pointing them out - I saw that they were L7's and ignored them, thinking for sure they'd use L1, the wide open setting. But then considering how close to the sun McNaught is, the sky may be so bright by the time the comet rises that L7 will work. And perhaps L7 will cut through the dust better than L1?

Posted by: CosmicRocker Jan 20 2007, 05:51 AM

Sweet. An image of McNaught would be a nice feather in the cap for one of these Renaissance Rovers. Apparently Opportunity will also make an attempt. I'd guess they'll have more opportunities to try to catch it in coming sols.

I'm sorry. I might not have been clear about that, as there are also vugs in that image. I was referring to the sharply angular grains hugging the blueberry in the upper left corner. This section of rock seems to have undergone some recrystallization that caused it to change rather dramatically in appearance as compared to other parts of the section in Eagle Crater. They too might be merely the preserved shapes of previous crystals that were later replaced by another mineral, but I can't speak to that. It appears likely that this was the Whatanga contact we saw in Endurance. Does anyone know where that name comes from?
Ok, I'll stop talking about Opportunity in a Spirit topic.

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 20 2007, 10:19 AM

Added a few images.

The Pancam L2 panoramic view taken on Sol 1081.

jvandriel

Posted by: tedstryk Jan 21 2007, 02:37 PM

Good work...I also played around a bit with Sol 1081.

http://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sol10813vq.jpg

Posted by: Tesheiner Jan 23 2007, 01:58 PM

Spirit may have finished work at this outcrop because the plan for tosol (1087) is .

Posted by: general Jan 23 2007, 08:45 PM

http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/pancam/2007-01-22/2P222482431EFFASCGP2749R7M1.JPG

comet????

Posted by: fredk Jan 23 2007, 09:01 PM

Unfortunately all there seems to be is cosmic ray hits. Notice how they're both above and below the horizon.

Posted by: fredk Jan 24 2007, 04:50 PM

I was wondering what the faint brightening was running across http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/1083/2P222482431EFFASCGP2749L7M1.JPG from the morning of sol 1083 comet search. Now that we have the corresponding http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/1083/2P222482431EFFASCGP2749R7M1.JPG we can see that the faint band is actually the horizon line and the left frame is actually mostly glare, perhaps from the rising sun?

Posted by: djellison Jan 24 2007, 04:55 PM

I think there must be a bug in the naming there - those two images can't have been taken at the same time - they are totally different pointings.

Doug

Posted by: fredk Jan 24 2007, 05:03 PM

Doug, you actually can see the horizon line in that left frame, if you look very closely. It matches the location from the http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/2/p/1083/2P222482233EFFASCGP2673L7M1.JPG that morning. (The 2 right frames that morning show that the camera didn't move between shots.) It's just that the image of the sky in the left frame in question is almost completely swamped by some glare that's mostly in the lower left of the frame. If you look at the http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/spirit_p1083.html it's pretty clear.

Posted by: djellison Jan 24 2007, 05:34 PM

Well that is just astonishing...totally bleached out. Bizarre

Doug

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 25 2007, 07:49 PM

The Panoramic view on Sol 1087.

Taken with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 25 2007, 09:55 PM

Here is a mosaic taken with the Mi cam on Sol 1085.

jvandriel

Posted by: Tesheiner Jan 26 2007, 08:49 AM

We have some fresh images from Spirit at the exploratorium. It moved again on sol 1089 towards Tyrone and is currently midway on this trek.
http://nasa.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/navcam/2007-01-25/
http://nasa.exploratorium.edu/mars/spirit/navcam/2007-01-26/

This is my attempt of sol 1087 navcam mosaic including Spirit's current position.

Posted by: climber Jan 26 2007, 08:09 PM

Here we are : 1000 sols over garenty

Posted by: jvandriel Jan 27 2007, 02:39 PM

The panoramic view looking back.

Taken wth the L7 Pancam on Sol 1087.

jvandriel

Posted by: djellison Jan 27 2007, 02:46 PM

Who'd have thought they'd need drive direction imagery after spending eleventy seven million sols parked in the area.

Doug

Posted by: Tman Jan 27 2007, 04:16 PM

It could be that in the meantime some rock toppled or a meteorite impacted a large hole

Posted by: mhoward Jan 30 2007, 04:26 AM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/marscat/374103366/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/marscat/374103025/

Posted by: Shaka Jan 30 2007, 07:56 PM

Hmmm... back to the 'popcorn sulfides'. I wonder if we dare try to travel along them to get nearer to the morass, or if this location becomes our perch to mini-Tes the area. Do the codes show more driving tomorrow?

Posted by: mhoward Jan 30 2007, 08:19 PM

You know, from here, with the benefit of hindsight, I think the area where Spirit got stuck looks like the big sand trap that it turned out to be. I still think there is a way around to the south - but I gather from the http://athena.cornell.edu/news/mubss/ that they'll be heading back to Home Plate after finishing at Tyrone. There is certainly no shortage of targets around here - I hope Spirit can keep going for a long time.

Posted by: Shaka Jan 30 2007, 08:36 PM

From the statements of SS and others in the hierarchy, I conclude that climbing McCool, or any other hill with lots of exposed bedrock, is now in the 'too hard' basket. I concede that it would be a form of Russian roulette, with the stuck wheel. I think the PIs will be looking for scientific targets Spirit can reach while plowing through sand, probably from Home Plate toward the south.

Posted by: fredk Jan 30 2007, 08:38 PM

According to the http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/status_spiritAll.html#sol1085, 10 metres is as close as they dare get:

Posted by: Tesheiner Jan 31 2007, 10:38 AM

Another small step on sol 1094.
This is the current position, as seen from the previous one on sol 1092.

Posted by: mhoward Feb 1 2007, 12:58 AM

The full sol 1092-1093 Navcam pan:

http://flickr.com/photos/marscat/374102872/

Posted by: Phil Stooke Feb 1 2007, 02:21 PM

Here's a polar version of mhoward's new panorama. The tracks show up really well.

Phil

Posted by: Oersted Feb 1 2007, 03:05 PM

What happened to "the Abyss"? Those two dark streaks one third in from either side... Was a new layer of sand dumped in the middle of it, and are they the edges of it? - Sorry if this has been observed before, maybe it is just me not following the mission close enough.

Posted by: ustrax Feb 1 2007, 03:08 PM

You can catch up what has been happening on El Dorado in http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=3199.

Posted by: Tesheiner Feb 1 2007, 03:22 PM

The rover is currently (as of sol 1094/1095) at about that distance. Well, between 10m and 13m; Tyrone is quite big. But that seems to be not close enough so yet another move is on the plan: sol 1096.

I hope that's the last one (*). I'm eager to see this little machine on the way to Home Plate again!

Edited: (*) I think it'll probably be the last one. If the plan is to study Tyrone with the pancam and mini-TES, there is no need (imo) to spend more then the weekend on those activities. Let's see if we can say "Good bye Tyrone" by next monday.

Posted by: fredk Feb 2 2007, 12:10 AM

Nice polar, Phil, thanks.

From the latest http://www.planetary.org/news/2007/0131_Mars_Exploration_Rovers_Update_Spirit.html, an explanation of the interest in returning towards Tyrone:

andAfter homeplate, the plan is toYes!

Posted by: jvandriel Feb 3 2007, 12:09 PM

Here is the complete Navcam panoramic view taken on

Sol 1092 and Sol 1093.

Taken with the L0 Navcam.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Feb 3 2007, 12:39 PM

Another panoramic view of the wheeltracks in front and at the back of Spirit.

Taken with the L0 Navcam on Sol 1094.

jvandriel

Posted by: jvandriel Feb 3 2007, 01:15 PM

and the last one for tosol

the complete 360 degree panoramic view taken

with the L0 Navcam on Sol 1096.

jvandriel

Posted by: centsworth_II Feb 3 2007, 05:03 PM

Is it too early to speculate on where Spirit will spend it's third winter?

Posted by: dilo Feb 3 2007, 06:43 PM

Found some time for usual projections, based on Sol 1092/1093 jv beautiful stitch:

Posted by: Phil Stooke Feb 4 2007, 12:50 AM

Here is jvandriel's new pan in my version of a polar projection.

Phil

Posted by: Stu Feb 5 2007, 06:31 PM

Definitely an area to avoid when walking in rippable spacesuits...

Posted by: Ant103 Feb 5 2007, 06:56 PM

Arrhhh!! Stu, you was the faster

Here is my version of this rock named "Zucchelli"...

Left pancame eye :
http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Spirit/Images_en_couleur/ZucchelliRock-Sol1091.JPG

And a color anaglyph, who show particulary good the features relief :
http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Spirit/Images_en_couleur/ZucchelliRock-Sol1091-anaglyphic.JPG

It's a very beautiful rock for me .

Posted by: Shaka Feb 5 2007, 07:29 PM

Yes, Ant, but I question whether it is hard and sharp enough to be hazardous. It might crumble in your hand like pie crust. I think my spacesuit can handle it.

Posted by: Stu Feb 5 2007, 11:35 PM

Famous last words...

<rip>

Pffffffffffffffffffffsssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhssssss
sssssssssss.......

Ack!!!!

Posted by: Shaka Feb 5 2007, 11:57 PM

Ah, but you don't know about the outer covering of diamond-impregnated buckyball-studded spider silk...hee hee. Resists x-ray lasers and chain-saws. (long as you don't stub your toe)

Posted by: Oersted Feb 7 2007, 09:42 PM

I must be getting old, I actually replied to that thread back in 2006...

Thx Ustrax

Posted by: CosmicRocker Feb 8 2007, 06:00 AM

As it is for me, our fourmi friend. Regardless of whether that weathered rock was sharp enough to shear Shaka's spider silk space suit, your color anaglyph reminded me why the wily winds on this pristine planet create similarly surprising structures all around.

Posted by: nprev Feb 8 2007, 06:17 AM

What I find fascinating is that almost none of these, well, extravagant features could possibly survive intact after more than a century or two on Earth given weather, etc. Does the fact that we see them now in this random epoch via Oppy tell us something about Martian climactic stability, to say nothing of routine real-time weathering?

Posted by: dvandorn Feb 8 2007, 07:44 AM

Practicing pleasing, poetic phrasing, Tom?

-the other Doug

Posted by: CosmicRocker Feb 9 2007, 04:05 AM

nprev: I'm sure the fact that delicate, wind-sculpted features have been commonly imaged by both rovers has a lot to do with pretty long periods of relatively constant climatic conditions. I think, too, that the absence of rainfall and critters climbing all around are factors. ...and, up until recently, multi-wheeled, off-road vehicles were unheard of...

other Doug: Ya' know, I was in a rare state of mind last night. Once I started downhill with that "...for me...fourmi" line, and then slid into alliteration, it became a very slippery slope. (...must resist the urge!)

Posted by: dilo Feb 11 2007, 09:08 AM

A couple of two-frames L257 stitches from Sol1098/99 (Tyrone tracks) and Sol1100 (Eldorado):

Posted by: climber Feb 11 2007, 10:10 AM

Thanks Dilo, Tyrone is a pure beauty here (even if it's also a Beast)

Posted by: Ant103 Feb 11 2007, 11:11 AM

Nice pics Dilo

My owns :
http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Spirit/Panoramas_couleur/Tyrone-Sol1099.jpg

http://www.astrosurf.com/merimages/Spirit/Panoramas_couleur/HusbandHill-Sol1101.jpg

Posted by: jvandriel Feb 11 2007, 11:57 AM

Here is the complete 360 degree panoramic view taken on Sol 1103

with the L0 Navcam. ( included Dust Devil )

jvandriel

Posted by: alan Feb 11 2007, 05:56 PM

The bright material dug up by Spirit at Tyrone reminds me of the bright deposits left at the ends of the recent gullies spotted by Mars Global Surveyor.

This is my scenario for the formation of the bright material and the nearby popcorn sulfides: When Homeplate and the other nearby features on McCool Hill formed they melted salt rich permafrost below the surface. The groundwater produced spread from these hotspots eventually approaching or reaching the surface in low lying areas. When the ground water appoached the surface slowly it would evaporate as the pressure decreased leaving behind the dissolved salts as deposits in the soil. If liquid water was formed fast enough for it to reach the surfuce and form pools the water would flash evaporate leaving behind clumps of material leaving popcorn sulfides.

Any of the geologists think this sounds like a realistic scenario?

Posted by: fredk Feb 11 2007, 07:31 PM

I'm no geologist, but it does sound similar to what some team members are speculating, http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=3446&view=findpost&p=82400

Posted by: nprev Feb 11 2007, 08:28 PM

Indeed.

Again, I think that studying mine tailings in the western US would prove quite illuminating for understanding Gusev. Clearly, there is some metal-enrichment of various sorts that led to salt production after exposure to moisture; what seems strange to me is how it's been sorted out into near-surface layers instead of mixed back into the substrate via wind action, small impacts, etc. Are the mixing processes that slow, or, dare I say it, are these precipitates the result of atmospheric moisture interacting with the near surface?

Posted by: CosmicRocker Feb 11 2007, 10:32 PM

The rocks of HP and the hills were formed so very long ago that it is difficult to speculate on the temperature and atmospheric pressure that existed at the time. We don't know if these salts were formed early, or much later. My gut feeling is that when the rocks were formed it was too warm for permafrost at this latitude, and that atmospheric pressure might have been significantly higher. It sounds as if the water bump seen in the mini-TES spectra is thought to be caused by bound water in the sulphates, and that the sulfates are seen in the regolith. Since the regolith came after the original rocks were formed, the salts had to move in later.

It does seem that one current hypothesis is that acid solutions moving down through the hills leached the salts from the rocks and deposited them where the water exited layers down here in the basin. I think others had previously hypothesized leaching of rocks in a hot, steamy scenario related to the postulated volcanic origin of Home Plate and related rocks.

Posted by: Marz Mar 15 2007, 06:26 PM

Sorry if someone already posted this link in another forum thread, but it seems to have recent and relevant discussions on Spirit's sulfate salts:

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/features/mars_rover/

I highlighted a few pieces of the text I thought was interesting:

Some of the bright soil from Tyrone was dragged to the winter site by the right front wheel, and Spirit spent some time measuring the composition and mineralogy of these materials. The material is sulfur-rich and consists of sulfate salts associated with iron, and likely calcium. "These salts could have been concentrated by hydrothermal liquid or vapor moving through the local rocks," said rover science team member Dr. Albert Yen, a geochemist at JPL. Two other patches of bright soil uncovered by Spirit before Tyrone were also sulfur-rich, but each had similarities to local rock compositions that were different at the three sites, suggesting localized origins.

Researchers will watch for more patches of bright soil. "If we find them along fractures, that would suggest they were deposited at ancient gas vents," Arvidson said. "If they are at the saddles between hills, that would suggest the deposits formed where groundwater came to the surface."

Posted by: Shaka Mar 15 2007, 07:17 PM

Hmmm... "along fractures"? Can anyone indicate where such fractures might be in the Columbia Hills? Are the known salty deposits anywhere near such fractures? I'm wondering if this issue of the origin of the salts hasn't already been decided. Groundwater seeps I can grok, but "gas vents" will require some startling new observations.

Posted by: dvandorn Mar 16 2007, 06:10 AM

I still wouldn't rule out a role for hydrothermal factors in the emplacement of Home Plate layers and in the deposition of salt-rich soils.

-the other Doug

Posted by: Geographer Jun 20 2007, 07:27 AM

Is there any long range (as in distance) goal for Spirit? Or is it fated to die in the Columbia Hills?

Posted by: djellison Jun 20 2007, 07:28 AM

The geological promised land to the south of Home Plate was always suggested as a later target, but with the limited mobility of 5 wheel drive, it would be a very tough call.

Doug

Posted by: alan Jun 20 2007, 08:06 PM

I doubt Spirit will drive to the 'promised land' this year, maybe next Mars year. They have already spent over 100 sols thoroughly examining just this side of Home Plate. There is still the south west side of Home Plate to investigate. Then there are Von Braun, Goddard, Oberth, Koralev, and Faget. Hopefully we will be able to see all of those before Spirit needs to find a new winter quarters around sol 1475, only 245 sols from now.

Posted by: MarsIsImportant Jun 20 2007, 08:36 PM

Can Spirit survive another winter on Mars?

Last winter was a close call. The recent cleaning event assures the survival of Spirit to at least winter, but continued dust deposition could end Spirit tour of duty. I'm glad that the cleaning event occurred, but images suggest it was only in spots. The swirling around of the dust may have buried some solar cells deeper in dust, while uncovering others. Further deposition will be much worse than it has been in the past because of this. Further depostion will bury all of the cells deeper in dust than the past because it appears the rover is in an area of dust deposition and will be in this area for a long time to come. IMHO We need another cleaning event to get better assurance that the rover will survive the upcoming winter.

Posted by: centsworth_II Jun 20 2007, 09:53 PM

One thing's for sure. They'll have to park at the absolute best angle
possible. No last minute rush to get to any north facing slope.

Posted by: Geographer Jun 21 2007, 09:48 AM

How much does it cost per day to keep each rover running? Is there any point at which NASA might just shut the program down even if they can still move because they can't justify the costs science-wise?

Posted by: djellison Jun 21 2007, 10:29 AM

It's unlikely they'd ever shut them down if one was still mobile. Exact costs are not particularly well published - but taking the total mission cost to date and dividing it by the total number of sols, it runs at something like $360k/sol The actual cost of an extension is a lot less than that.

Doug

Posted by: CosmicRocker Jun 22 2007, 05:07 AM

I absolutely agree. I can't imagine anyone pulling the funding from a productive rover, unless one survives too long. That's an interesting question. Which future explorers on Mars would threaten the funding of the MERs in their retirement years?

The cost of the extended missions should be way less than that. It's probably not an easy number to estimate accurately, but wouldn't it mostly be related to the number of people on the payroll that it takes to keep the rovers active?

Posted by: dvandorn Jun 22 2007, 05:54 AM

There are several costs in keeping the MERs active and operating. The largest cost is probably the staff of engineers, controllers and scientists who determine what the rovers do on a day-to-day basis, but there are other, not-insignificant costs, such as:

DSN time -- probably the largest non-payroll cost, using the DSN to communicate with the rovers (or, more specifically, to communicate with Odyssey as it relays to and from the rovers) costs somewhere in the thousands of dollars per hour, IIRC.

engineering support equipment -- specifically, there are the ground models of the MERs that are used to simulate various previously-untried activities. They used these ground models (one of which is nothing but the drive system, I know) to figure out how to safely drive on steep slopes, and how to get unstuck from killer rover-trap dunes. The equipment has to be maintained, and people who are only tangentially involved in MER operations have to be retained to operate this equipment.

Mars yard -- JPL, as far as I know, still maintains a Mars yard in which various MER operations are rehearsed. That also takes resources and manpower to configure and use. Yes, they at JPL have created a new, larger Mars yard for MSL rehearsals and study, but I believe the old one is still being used for MER operations.

While the per-sol costs of the MERs drops steadily as time goes on, because by far the greatest costs of the mission were in spacecraft design & assembly and booster procurement and we're now simply amortizing the costs over a longer and longer time frame, there are still real costs that will continue as long as the MERs keep operating.

All of that said, the incremental costs of keeping the MERs running are worth it, I think, as long as at least one of them remains mobile. The fate of mission extensions after a major failure really depends on what type of failure occurs. For example, if Oppy loses the ability to deploy its IDD but is otherwise in good shape, I imagine there will be mission extensions until something else fails. But if both rovers become immobile, you *may* see them shut down after they examine their near fields as thoroughly as possible.

-the other Doug

Posted by: fredk Jun 22 2007, 05:09 PM

Surely, though, as low as the costs are to keep the rovers running now, it would be far cheaper to keep in contact with them after both have stopped moving (shudder). They'd become long term weather stations of sorts, and Spirit could keep monitoring dust devils if the cameras work and it has a decent view.

Posted by: Geographer Jun 28 2007, 06:49 AM

Thanks dvandorn. I've noticed the mission managers have changed throughout the years, I presume the engineers have as well. Might the engineers be needed for another mission (MSL)?

Posted by: dvandorn Jun 28 2007, 07:00 AM

Unfortunately, the MERs are drastically under-equipped to serve as meteorological stations. They have no instrumentation for directly analyzing winds, pressures and temperatures. The only instruments that can capture weather data are the cameras, and while you can take cool images of dust devils and boring images of the Sun to measure tau, I'm not sure we'd see mission extensions solely for those purposes once an immobile rover's near field has been examined as carefully as possible.

-the other Doug

Posted by: djellison Jun 28 2007, 07:06 AM

Mini-TES does good atmospheric science, and indeed so does the APXS w.r.t. Argon loading.

Doug

Posted by: dvandorn Jun 28 2007, 07:08 AM

Yes, many of the engineers and scientists, as well as managers, who were with the MER project from the beginning have moved on to other projects. Some are working on Phoenix, some on MSL, and others are working on other mission proposals. Some (though a very few, I imagine) are working somewhere else entirely, not in the planetary probe business.

It's like any organization that operates for more than a short period -- you get turnover. Some people leave to pursue other interests, some are recruited into projects where their expertise is needed, and some (like the Entry, Descent Landing, or EDL, team) find their jobs at an end once a given mission phase is completed. For example, Rob Manning was one of the key engineers on the Pathfinder and MER EDL teams. Rob has been working on MSL's landing system for a couple of years now, and has been kind enough to keep all of us here at UMSF up to date on their progress... But once both MERs were safely landed on Mars, Rob and others on the EDL team were freed up to pursue other projects.

-the other Doug

Posted by: dvandorn Jun 28 2007, 07:24 AM

True. But atmospheric science isn't the same as meteorology, or as it was described, a "weather station." It's a fine line, I know. But for telling us anything about the actual weather at a MER location, all of the rovers' instrumentation is, IMHO, less valuable than would have been a stick with a small windsock (or just pieces of yarn) attached to it.

There is a point at which you have to decide if the salaries, DSN time, and managerial overhead for which you have to pay as long as the MERs are kept alive are justified by the amount of new and unique data you can get. Yes, you can get some interesting data about the air column above the MERs from mini-TES, and you can get some rather averaged air composition data from the APXS. Is that worth expenditures of several million dollars per extension for an otherwise immobile and mined-out (i.e., local field as minutely examined as possible) MER?

As long as the near field can be changed (i.e., as long as a MER is mobile), it's a no-brainer. You'd continue to extend the mission, even if you were to completely lose an IDD or even mini-TES. But once you can no longer move, I'd be surprised if the mission would be extended once an "endgame" plan for maximizing return from your final location was completed.

-the other Doug

Posted by: AndyG Jun 28 2007, 08:37 AM

Maximizing return could mean all sorts, though - very long term study of the last rover tracks to monitor erosion processes, the invaluable engineering data with regards to which-bits-fail-first. And an immobile rover would even be a benefit with regards to selling future Mars missions to the public. If Opportunity should end up stuck at the base of a Victoria cliff, unable to move, I'd want to see a timelapse film of "a day in Victoria", in full colour, necessarily shot over a few weeks or so. Just imagine how beautiful that could be.

Andy

Posted by: fredk Jun 28 2007, 02:12 PM

I wrote "weather station of sorts", and perhaps should have stressed "of sorts"! Of course the rovers can't do an in depth meteorological study. My point was simply that it's a question of cost. Surely it's far cheaper to run them without mobility, but the question is how cheap. Someone has to work out the numbers, then sit down and decide whether what the rovers can do stationary justifies that expense. Until then we're just counting angels.

Posted by: dvandorn Jun 28 2007, 04:08 PM

Bringing up the question, how many MERs can dance on the head of a pin?

The real issue of extension costs, in my mind, is the cost of DSN time. If you can cut down your support staff here on Earth to minimum levels and just be taking repetitive images and passive data, you do cut your costs down some. But at several thousand dollars per hour of DSN time, the cost of just getting your data back to Earth runs into the millions of dollars a year, even with passive, nearly dead rovers.

There is a lot of focus on reducing the cost per pound to get spacecraft into LEO and beyond. I think there needs to be a similar effort to reduce the cost of communicating with your spacecraft once they leave LEO, or else you'll continue to see probes which have a lot of life left in them abandoned due to the costs of keeping in regular contact with them.

-the other Doug

Posted by: djellison Jun 28 2007, 04:45 PM

Well - of course - all the MER downlink is via Odyssey, and thus they don't pay a direct DSN cost for that. (But they do, I think, pay Odyssey for it)

The uplink via DFE X-band to the HGA is from the DSN, but that's not a long period. Maybe, between the two of them, 1hr per day. There was some discovery mission documentation that outlined the maths to figure out how much DSN time costs...I'll have to dig it up again.

Doug

Posted by: Stu Jul 5 2007, 05:10 PM

Been neglecting Spirit recently, what with Oppy's Victoria adventure, but here's an interesting rock I spotted today...

Posted by: Stu Jul 12 2007, 06:02 AM

My first try with"Autostitch"... interesting little rock peered at by Spirit's microscope yesterday...

Posted by: nprev Jul 12 2007, 06:09 AM

By God, it's the head of the Smiling Crocodile! He's lying on his right side...

Posted by: edstrick Jul 12 2007, 09:03 AM

"By God, it's the head of the Smiling Crocodile! He's lying on his right side..."

Does anybody hear a clock ticking?

Posted by: djellison Jul 12 2007, 09:09 AM

Now we'e heard that 20-25M figure at that press con - we can say that running the rovers costs approx $55 - 70k per day - or $27-35k per rover per day. As my colleague Josh has just pointed out - about the same, per rover, as David Beckham gets paid

Doug

Posted by: climber Jul 12 2007, 07:37 PM

Yep, but I guess he doesn't need Nasa's ok when he wants to better study Victoria