AVIATR - Titan Airplane Mission Concept, Proposed unmanned aerial exploration of Titan |
AVIATR - Titan Airplane Mission Concept, Proposed unmanned aerial exploration of Titan |
Nov 24 2011, 01:59 AM
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#46
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Merciless Robot Group: Admin Posts: 8785 Joined: 8-December 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 602 |
Ah! Thanks, Jason; feelin' warmer & fuzzier!
-------------------- A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
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Nov 26 2011, 02:35 AM
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#47
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Member Group: Members Posts: 723 Joined: 13-June 04 Member No.: 82 |
I wonder if, instead of a virtually financially impossible Titan Flagship Mission, it would be possible to have a series of lower-cost Discovery-class missions to Titan, spread over a span of years? I assume that this would be possible only if launch costs drop by an order of magnitude or more, which could happen if Elon Musk is correct about having his Falcon 9 and Falcon Heavy launch vehicles be totally or mostly reusable.
If we have launch costs be a fairly small fraction of the total program costs, then would it be feasible to have a payload launched to Titan every launch opportunity, with the first being for example an orbiter / relay station with Radar and IR imagers / spectrometers, the second being a TiME lake floater (transmitting via the orbiter for much higher data rates), the third being an AVIATR aircraft (again, transmitting to Earth via the orbiter), etc.? Similar, in other words, to the recent Mars exploration program. How would the costs compare to a Titan Flagship mission, and how would the science results compare? Is this a foolish notion, or does it have real possibilities? |
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Nov 26 2011, 05:00 PM
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#48
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Member Group: Members Posts: 715 Joined: 22-April 05 Member No.: 351 |
Your idea of a number of lower cost missions has been proposed. Titan as a target for repeated missions has pluses (pretty benign environment) and minuses (long cruise times at ~$10M/year). My blog entry next week (futureplanets.blogspot.com) will look at the options for this approach (this week will be on the Mars 2016 and 2018 missions).
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Nov 26 2011, 05:07 PM
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#49
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1729 Joined: 3-August 06 From: 43° 35' 53" N 1° 26' 35" E Member No.: 1004 |
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Nov 26 2011, 05:09 PM
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#50
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Merciless Robot Group: Admin Posts: 8785 Joined: 8-December 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 602 |
Guys, in the name of keeping this thread on topic, suggest placing any posts about other possible future missions & architectures here.
-------------------- A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
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Dec 23 2011, 11:25 PM
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#51
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Member Group: Members Posts: 131 Joined: 30-August 06 From: Moscow, Idaho Member No.: 1086 |
The AVIATR team has published a paper about the mission concept in Experimental Astronomy that's just come out online. You can download it here if you're interested.
- Jason |
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Dec 24 2011, 02:43 AM
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#52
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1592 Joined: 14-October 05 From: Vermont Member No.: 530 |
Interesting that the Mongolfiere requires an MMRTG while the plane requires an ASRG. And they both need Pu-238.
How do you predict goop accumulation on the optical windows? And ice/goop accumulation on the lifting surfaces? |
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Dec 24 2011, 06:02 AM
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#53
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Member Group: Members Posts: 715 Joined: 22-April 05 Member No.: 351 |
Jason - Has your team every looked into including a small relay orbiter with the mission? At an estimated cost of ~$700M, you would seem to have ~$300M for a satellite for a New Frontiers mission. Given that the JET orbiter was a Discovery proposal ($425M) and assuming some common costs, $300M doesn't seem too far off. I presume a relay orbiter would increase data return by a couple of orders of magnitude.
Of course, we need to get Titan added to the list of New Frontiers targets... -------------------- |
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Dec 24 2011, 09:46 PM
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#54
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Member Group: Members Posts: 715 Joined: 22-April 05 Member No.: 351 |
I wonder if, instead of a virtually financially impossible Titan Flagship Mission, it would be possible to have a series of lower-cost Discovery-class missions to Titan, spread over a span of years? I provided my thoughts on this question here. -------------------- |
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Dec 25 2011, 07:13 PM
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#55
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1018 Joined: 29-November 05 From: Seattle, WA, USA Member No.: 590 |
We're looking far enough in the future that laser communications may be viable: http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2011/aug/H...Selections.html
If that really can deliver a 100x increase in bandwidth, I'd think that would be the way to go. Obviously a laser might have some problems getting through Titan's clouds, but a relay satellite seems like a much better deal if it can deliver such a huge improvement in the quantity of data transmitted. Put differently, are we doing these things in the wrong order? Shouldn't we shoot for a long-lived Titan orbiter first and then plan for all the following missions to use it as a relay? --Greg |
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Dec 25 2011, 10:26 PM
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#56
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Merciless Robot Group: Admin Posts: 8785 Joined: 8-December 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 602 |
(sigh)...Guys, once again, please keep this thread focused on AVIATR itself. Post here for other future mission concepts, proposals, and relevant, realistic enabling technologies.
-------------------- A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
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Jan 3 2012, 02:06 AM
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#57
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Senior Member Group: Moderator Posts: 2785 Joined: 10-November 06 From: Pasadena, CA Member No.: 1345 |
AVIATR mission concept written up in Universe Today: http://www.universetoday.com/92286/aviatr-...sion-for-titan/
-------------------- Some higher resolution images available at my photostream: http://www.flickr.com/photos/31678681@N07/
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Jan 11 2012, 04:48 PM
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#58
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Senior Member Group: Moderator Posts: 2785 Joined: 10-November 06 From: Pasadena, CA Member No.: 1345 |
space.com article: http://www.space.com/14191-titan-drone-air...plore-moon.html
-------------------- Some higher resolution images available at my photostream: http://www.flickr.com/photos/31678681@N07/
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Jan 11 2012, 06:22 PM
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#59
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Merciless Robot Group: Admin Posts: 8785 Joined: 8-December 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 602 |
Great write-up & illustrations. Congrats, Jason & Mike!
-------------------- A few will take this knowledge and use this power of a dream realized as a force for change, an impetus for further discovery to make less ancient dreams real.
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