Phobos-Grunt Options

[Guest_Zvezdichko_*]

Yes, it's a better for the mission to be delayed.

Anyway, I find it a bit sad that we are missing a Mars window for a first time during the last 20 years. Well, not exactly 20 years, but... at least since Mars Observer.

The best thing that could happen will be a revival of Phoenix, but I don't have high hopes for this.

[Paolo]

1994 was the last unused Mars launch window

[Guest_Zvezdichko_*]

Despite the information from Lev Zelenyi, Roscosmos still hasn't announced an official delay.

According to Anatoly Zak, russianspaceweb.com editor, Russia will announce the official delay today. It's expected the delay to be based on the results of testings, but Zak has another opinion - the project started in 2007 and time to develop and test the spacecraft was insufficient.

[Paolo]

Yes, what is interesting is that Zelenyi is reported saying that the problem was just time, and that the program was properly financed

[Guest_Zvezdichko_*]

Roscosmos still hasn't announced an official delay, despite speculations that today was going to be the big day. This is what Zak says and this is also what I see on Roscosmos site.

[Liss]

Roscosmos did confirmed the delay, sort of.
In today's Rossiyskaya Gazeta, head of Roscosmos Anatoliy Perminov spoke about it as of old news.
He told that the delay was requested by the Bureau of Space Souncil of the Russian Academy of Sciences.
He also spoke about three problems leading to delay:
(1) They do not know exactly what is Phobos soil like and which type of soil capture device would be the best.
(2) They do not have 100% comms coverage yet.
(3) More careful testing of component elements is needed.

http://www.rg.ru/2009/09/29/perminov.html

For those speaking Russian there is the related excerpt:

РГ: А что с космическим аппаратом "Фобос-Грунт", запуск которого к спутнику Марса планировался в середине октября?

Перминов: Бюро совета РАН по космосу рекомендовало перенести реализацию этой научной миссии на октябрь 2011 года.

РГ: Почему?

Перминов: Для того чтобы обеспечить более высокую ее надежность. Ученые рассчитывают уточнить характер самой поверхности Фобоса. Это нужно, чтобы точнее сконструировать устройство для забора грунта. Если грунт слишком твердый, то неправильно выбранный способ его забора может свести к нулю результат столь дорогой экспедиции. Кроме того, пока не достигнута 100-процентная надежность дублированной непрерывной связи с аппаратом на всех этапах полета. Нужна и более надежная отработка составных элементов.

РГ: А с чем связан перенос именно на два года? Если бы аппарат был запущен сейчас, то к апрелю 2011 года он уже сел бы на Фобос...

Перминов: В 2011 году открывается наиболее оптимальное астрономическое окно для полета к Марсу и его спутнику. Это позволит "Фобос-Грунту" по кратчайшей траектории достичь цели и вернуться назад.

[climber]

My Russian is good enough to understand 2011

[algorimancer]

2011

Mine might extend to "April 2011", but I wouldn't swear to it

[charborob]

Google translation:

RG: What's wrong with the spacecraft Phobos-Grunt, which is to launch a satellite of Mars was planned in mid-October?
Perminov: Office of Space Sciences Board recommended to postpone the implementation of this scientific mission in October 2011.
RG: Why?
Perminov: In order to ensure greater reliability. Scientists expect to clarify the nature of the surface of Phobos. It is necessary to better design a device for collecting soil. If your soil is too hard, then the wrong way to the fence could nullify the results of such an expensive expedition. Furthermore, not yet achieved 100 percent reliability duplicated continuous communication with the staff on all phases of flight. Need more reliable and working out its constituent elements.
RG: And from what port it is connected to two years? If the machine was running now, by April 2011 he would have sat on Phobos ...
Perminov: In 2011 was called the best possible astronomical window for the flight to Mars and its moons. This will allow the "Phobos-Grunt" on the shortest path to reach the goal and back.

[mps]

Mine might extend to "April 2011", but I wouldn't swear to it

Actually, I think it is more something like that:
Rossiskaja Gazeta: Why exactly a two-year delay? If the spacecraft had launched now, it would arrive Phobos already in April 2011...

EDIT: charborob was quicker

[mps]

Industry Insiders Foresaw Delay of Russia’s Phobos-Grunt

the far biggest issue for Phobos-Grunt, sources familiar with the program said, was the flight readiness of the onboard flight control system.

Problems with the spacecraft’s onboard flight control system can be traced back to an early, controversial decision by Phobos-Grunt’s lead contractor, NPO Lavochkin, to build the probe’s BKU in house rather than outsource the job to OKB Mars, the Moscow-based firm that supplies most of Lavochkin’s flight control computers.

[Paolo]

Industry Insiders Foresaw Delay of Russia’s Phobos-Grunt

Beside the fact that Medvezhiy Ozera is near Moscow, not near St Petersburg, anybody knows why Yevpatoria is no longer mentioned? is the Ukrainian deep space station abandoned?

[Eugen]

Beside the fact that Medvezhiy Ozera is near Moscow, not near St Petersburg, anybody knows why Yevpatoria is no longer mentioned? is the Ukrainian deep space station abandoned?

Its still not abandoned. At last few year those facilities participate at such projects as:
- "Cosmic Call" project in 1999 and 2003
- LFVN from PulKon (ПулКон) in 2006-2007
But as I think our government is not interested in the space research. Often sound and appeals to the closure of the center of "economic reasons". Some information about the center you can find there (but in russian)

[tolis]

Hi All,

According to www.russiansdpaceweb.com/phobos_grunt_preflight.html#delay2009
the Phobos Grunt mission as intended to fly in 2009 is too heavy for the 2011 launch window.
It will have to lose 150 kg to allow the same Zenit LV to hurl it to Mars.

I would imagine this is not news to the Russian ballisticians in change of P-B trajectory analysis.
Launch window quality is usually known decades in advance of the actual flight projects
that utilise them.

In addition, the 2011 window does not allow a Mars orbit insertion directly into an equatorial
orbit (where Phobos is); therefore more fuel is needed to "zero out" the probe's orbital inclination.

It will be interesting to see how the problem is tackled. Some obvious options would be
either switching to a more powerful LV (a Proton is mentioned in the article) or losing
some of the payload.

What I'm not sure I understand is previous statements regarding the possibility of flying a MetNet Precursor mission
piggyback on P-G in 2011. Surely, one would not want to *add* payload to a vehicle that is already
overweight.

Perhaps someone can shed some light into all this.

Tolis.

[Hungry4info]

I heard PhobosGrunt would have the MetLander (name?) added onto it now that it's targeted for the 2011 window. Apparently, this is unfeasible (and I think the mission is too complex for its own good anyway). Can they just drop the Chinese probe?