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Dawn Framing Camera Q&A, Ask your questions to the Framing Camera Operations Team
pjam
post Jul 1 2011, 04:36 PM
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Hallo and welcome, Pablo!

That post on Dawn FC team organization and activity is gold! Almost puts us there...
Good luck with the coming weeks & months, and thanks for volunteering to be the liasion.

...This is a good time to be alive!

-pjam


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hendric
post Jul 1 2011, 05:29 PM
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Have you guys solved any interesting problems?

As an engineer myself, I like hearing about "war stories" from others. Once recent one for me was customers returning boards because they couldn't program the flash and it turned out that we had purchased these NAND flashes from brokers (kinda grey-market-ish), and when we scanned them, we found text strings like "Discovery Channel, Disney, etc". Apparently they were originally programmed for a set-top box and were remaindered, and our manufacturing program didn't erase them, because the spec for the NAND said they would come erased. Whoops!

Then there's the story about the chip that wouldn't boot properly the second time you powered it on, because a certain power rail decayed so slowly that 3 seconds after power off, it was still a couple of hundred millivolts, and when the processor turned on, it corrupted the internal state enough to cause a crash. That one was a real head-scratcher for me, first time I'd seen a problem caused by a power supply not powering down fast enough!


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ngunn
post Jul 2 2011, 08:24 AM
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QUOTE (pablogm1024 @ Jul 1 2011, 10:44 AM) *
Concerning the work of the amateurs, we are simply amazed at the dedication you put into this hobby, and indeed we are considering getting in touch with some of the contributor to evaluate possible collaborations.


Seeing what's been happening with the latest image that looks like a very good idea. laugh.gif

Seriously, I'd like to add my heartfelt thanks to you for letting us all 'inside' the Dawn mission as far as your remit allows. I hope that the resulting positive experience on both sides will continue to move mission management towards a more Cassini-like image release policy.
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pablogm1024
post Jul 2 2011, 09:43 PM
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QUOTE (hendric @ Jul 1 2011, 05:29 PM) *
Have you guys solved any interesting problems?

It is a general rule of politeness, that one should not talk about the war while it is still going on, but since Marc Rayman, the mission engineer, already talked about it in the mission blog, I would like to call your attention about the intelligent solution that the mission team envisioned to save the propellent hydrazine.
Regards,
Pablo


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pablogm1024
post Jul 2 2011, 09:49 PM
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QUOTE (Fran Ontanaya @ Jun 30 2011, 12:57 AM) *
Hola, Pablo. Will you attempt to use superresolution on interesting targets?

Hola Fran
I am afraid that you question falls more on the side of scientific analysis software than on the operations, but I will try to answer it.
The observation plan for the High Altitude Mapping Orbit (HAMO) already includes several views of each spot from different angles, that can provide sub-pixel resolution on the topographic model. I hope this answers your question.
Regards,
Pablo


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Norm Hartnett
post Jul 2 2011, 10:00 PM
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Ah, I see on the Dawn site that, in order to take Nav photos, the spacecraft has to stop thrusting. That would certainly explain the paltry number of pictures we have seen to date. Do you have a timeline of the number of Nav photo attempts planned for the next couple of weeks, Pablo?
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Phil Stooke
post Jul 2 2011, 10:04 PM
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If I may borrow this space to reply to Fran, even if super-resolution is not a goal of an imaging sequence, there will be opportunities to use it every time a multispectral image sequence is obtained. If a set of images are taken in quick succession through different filters, they can be combined to make a super-resolution composite. I have done this with Voyager images of Hyperion, for example. If there is a lot of colour variation in a scene, as we see on Io, this will not work, but for scenes with only minor colour variation it will be OK, and that will be true for Vesta.

Phil


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pablogm1024
post Jul 2 2011, 11:03 PM
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QUOTE (Norm Hartnett @ Jul 2 2011, 10:00 PM) *
Do you have a timeline of the number of Nav photo attempts planned for the next couple of weeks, Pablo?

Hi Norm,
The plan for this approach phase was to start by acquiring OpNav images once per week for the first 6 weeks and then change to twice per week, which is the rate that we currently have.
Regards,
Pablo


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Fran Ontanaya
post Jul 3 2011, 03:21 AM
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QUOTE (Phil Stooke @ Jul 2 2011, 11:04 PM) *
there will be opportunities to use it every time a multispectral image sequence is obtained.


Thanks. I wonder if the backup camera can be operated at the same time as the main, and if the team would get a waiver to do so at Ceres after the end of the primary mission.
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pablogm1024
post Jul 4 2011, 10:10 AM
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QUOTE (Fran Ontanaya @ Jul 3 2011, 03:21 AM) *
Thanks. I wonder if the backup camera can be operated at the same time as the main, and if the team would get a waiver to do so at Ceres after the end of the primary mission.

Hi Fran,
Yes, both cameras can operate concurrently and indeed, they have done so in the past... on ground. Currently there are no plans ot use both cameras concurrently and we have seen no reason to do so, but if you have a suggestions, please do not hesitate to speak up.
Regards,
Pablo


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Bjorn Jonsson
post Jul 4 2011, 01:43 PM
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Welcome to UMSF!

I have a few questions:

How many images do you expect to obtain while orbiting Vesta? Are some/all of the images compressed aboard the spacecraft before they are downlinked and if so is the compression lossy or lossless?

QUOTE (pablogm1024 @ Jun 30 2011, 03:35 PM) *
One day I was looking at the newly arrived images and, when my office mate asked me if he should fetch the rest of the team, all I could say was: "Give me just one minute to enjoy the images alone, and then you can get the team".

This is a familar feeling to me in a slightly different context though. There's something special about seeing a 'new' world clearly for the first time.
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pablogm1024
post Jul 5 2011, 09:59 AM
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QUOTE (Bjorn Jonsson @ Jul 4 2011, 01:43 PM) *
Are some/all of the images compressed aboard the spacecraft before they are downlinked and if so is the compression lossy or lossless?

Hi Bjorn,
It is out of discussion that, once you launch a mission into space, you have already made the biggest expense, so the way to get a return for this is getting science of the data. The overall data volume transmitted from the spacecraft has a significant impact in the DSN usage costs, so try to minimize the volume as long as it does not impact the science quality. This is why all the images we transmit are compressed, but loss-less. Later in the mission, there will be phases were certain types of images will be considered sub-prime and will therefore be compressed with loss. These will be images intended to provide a background but not worthy from the science point of view.
Regards,
Pablo


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Fran Ontanaya
post Jul 7 2011, 02:58 PM
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QUOTE (pablogm1024 @ Jul 4 2011, 11:10 AM) *
we have seen no reason to do so, but if you have a suggestions, please do not hesitate to speak up.


Perhaps to add them if a longer single exposure would suffer from smear.

Another question: is there a priority to capture and download first certain filters? Particulary clear, versus the ones more suitable for RGB, versus the ones suitable for trippy science color. laugh.gif
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pablogm1024
post Jul 9 2011, 10:30 PM
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QUOTE (Fran Ontanaya @ Jul 7 2011, 02:58 PM) *
Another question: is there a priority to capture and download first certain filters? Particulary clear, versus the ones more suitable for RGB, versus the ones suitable for trippy science color. laugh.gif

Yes, the camera implements a download priority scheme in four levels. The top priority is given to images acquired for the purpose of optical navigation (OpNav), like most of the images that we are acquiring now during the approach phase. The other three priorities are assigned to the different image acquisition depending on the purpose of a particular observation.

To all:
I am now on vacation in Spain, so I have limited access to internet. Please be patient in case it takes me a couple of days to answer your questions.


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Greg Hullender
post Jul 9 2011, 10:39 PM
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How long does the camera take to make a picture?

--Greg
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