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MSL Video
Jim from NSF.com
post Jun 5 2006, 08:54 PM
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Saw the MSL video, which was similar to the MER video. It was awesome. Will try to get a copy
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MarkL
post Nov 23 2006, 04:13 PM
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Check out this article if interested in more detail on MSL EDL. Doug, no matter how you slice it EDL is treacherous and requires perfect execution. It seems like a miracle that the little guys/gals get down in one piece.

Edit: Sadly, wouldn't be complete without this.
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djellison
post Nov 23 2006, 04:57 PM
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QUOTE (MarkL @ Nov 23 2006, 04:13 PM) *
Doug, no matter how you slice it EDL is treacherous and requires perfect execution. .


I totally and utterly agree 110% and would never suggest otherwise. However - there is much criticism of the skycrane manouver simply because it looks a bit scarey. So did Viking, so did MPF, so did MPL and so did MER. In some respects it is a hybrid of Viking and MER/MPF techniques...the throttled decent of Viking followed by lander seperation on a bridle and bridle cut at the surface.

I thnk I've been through every PDF I can find and I've even swopped emails with some JPL engineers about the MSL system. When you REALLY think about it - if it can be made to work (and I have no reason to see otherwise) it's arguably a more reliable means of getting things on the ground than the MER system, and certainly the most weight efficient way of getting a rover of that size on the ground.

Put it this way - I have a higher expectation of the MSL system than I would of a repeat of the MER/MPF system and arguably higher than the MPL/Phoenix pulse throttle system.

You are very wrong to label them as 'nuts' for leaving the MER system behind. It simply can not scale to MSL weight. They have to come up with a means of getting a rover on the ground outside that platform. The 'long decent with retro rockets' is actually going to be a shorter decent on retro rockets than was the case for Viking - only about 900 metres. Look at the efforts of Armadillo Aerospace with very little money and time to produce something which could be seen as similar to the MSL decent stage.

I'm not trying to ignore the difficulties...being here in Leicester, I really don't need to be reminded how hard landing on mars actually is... but I'm yet to see a sound argument against the MSL design based on anything other than 'it looks scarey'. With an atmosphere not thick enough to be usefull but thick enough to be a problem - landing on Mars will ALWAYS be scarey.

Doug

(PS - other cool docs - http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/handle/2014/39907 - http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/handle/2014/39871 and http://trs-new.jpl.nasa.gov/dspace/handle/2014/38898 )
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Posts in this topic
- Jim from NSF.com   MSL Video   Jun 5 2006, 08:54 PM
- - hal_9000   QUOTE (Jim from NSF.com @ Jun 5 2006, 05...   Jun 6 2006, 12:12 AM
|- - Stephen   QUOTE (hal_9000 @ Jun 6 2006, 12:12 AM) h...   Jun 6 2006, 04:23 AM
- - Toma B   QUOTE (Jim from NSF.com @ Jun 5 2006, 10...   Jun 6 2006, 12:31 PM
|- - Jim from NSF.com   B)-->QUOTE(Toma B @ Jun 6 2006, 08:31 AM)...   Jun 6 2006, 02:12 PM
|- - RonJones   QUOTE (Jim from NSF.com @ Jun 6 2006, 10...   Jun 6 2006, 04:46 PM
- - Toma B   There is GIGANTIC image of MSL here. Link to 25 MB...   Jun 6 2006, 05:55 PM
|- - Chmee   B)-->QUOTE(Toma B @ Jun 6 2006, 01:55 PM)...   Jun 6 2006, 08:21 PM
|- - gndonald   QUOTE (Chmee @ Jun 7 2006, 04:21 AM) --...   Jul 17 2006, 03:58 PM
- - BruceMoomaw   It is a stereo camera -- it just doesn't look ...   Jun 6 2006, 09:07 PM
|- - paxdan   One thing that the MERs have shown us is that the ...   Jun 7 2006, 07:51 AM
- - climber   Any possible use to detect Purgatory's sort of...   Jun 7 2006, 08:32 AM
- - climber   For quite a while, I've been frustrated that t...   Jun 7 2006, 09:31 AM
|- - Tesheiner   QUOTE (climber @ Jun 7 2006, 11:31 AM) Th...   Jun 7 2006, 10:19 AM
|- - climber   [quote name='Tesheiner' date='Jun 7 20...   Jun 7 2006, 04:01 PM
- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (paxdan @ Jun 7 2006, 03:51 AM) How...   Jun 7 2006, 03:34 PM
- - Tesheiner   No trick (follow the link clicking on the image); ...   Jun 7 2006, 04:12 PM
- - jamescanvin   I think it's the electorincs box for the micro...   Jun 8 2006, 12:43 AM
- - BruceMoomaw   There's no Mossbauer this time. Indeed, one s...   Jun 8 2006, 01:37 AM
- - hendric   Still no EDL video?? I'd like to add it to my ...   Jul 15 2006, 05:22 AM
- - PhilHorzempa   Any updates on the MSL entry and landing video? ...   Aug 1 2006, 03:43 AM
|- - Jim from NSF.com   QUOTE (PhilHorzempa @ Jul 31 2006, 11:43 ...   Aug 1 2006, 11:45 AM
|- - Jim from NSF.com   QUOTE (PhilHorzempa @ Jul 31 2006, 11:43 ...   Aug 3 2006, 04:20 AM
- - PhilHorzempa   For those interested in MSL's RTG system, here...   Aug 2 2006, 04:59 AM
|- - angel1801   Russia has said to the US that the US can buy Plut...   Aug 2 2006, 09:47 AM
||- - ljk4-1   QUOTE (angel1801 @ Aug 2 2006, 05:47 AM) ...   Aug 2 2006, 02:21 PM
|- - Chmee   QUOTE (PhilHorzempa @ Aug 2 2006, 12:59 A...   Aug 2 2006, 05:24 PM
|- - climber   QUOTE (Chmee @ Aug 2 2006, 07:24 PM) The ...   Aug 2 2006, 07:54 PM
||- - dilo   hmm.. "The working fluid is CFC-11". I ...   Aug 2 2006, 08:32 PM
|- - hendric   QUOTE (Chmee @ Aug 2 2006, 12:24 PM) Basi...   Aug 2 2006, 09:41 PM
- - mars_armer   A search on youtube for "JPL MSL" came u...   Nov 21 2006, 07:14 PM
|- - Stephen   QUOTE (mars_armer @ Nov 22 2006, 06:14 AM...   Nov 22 2006, 12:06 AM
|- - Navin   QUOTE (mars_armer @ Nov 21 2006, 02:14 PM...   Mar 16 2007, 02:49 AM
||- - Jim from NSF.com   QUOTE (Navin @ Mar 15 2007, 10:49 PM) The...   Mar 16 2007, 11:36 AM
||- - As old as Voyager   QUOTE (Navin @ Mar 16 2007, 02:49 AM) Thi...   Mar 16 2007, 12:03 PM
|- - ustrax   QUOTE (mars_armer @ Nov 21 2006, 07:14 PM...   Mar 16 2007, 11:26 AM
||- - djellison   QUOTE (ustrax @ Mar 16 2007, 11:26 AM) le...   Mar 16 2007, 11:40 AM
||- - ustrax   Doug... They're grown up now, our two girls ha...   Mar 16 2007, 11:49 AM
||- - mchan   Yes!!! More of them 3/4 ton rovers wi...   Mar 16 2007, 12:02 PM
|- - Stephen   QUOTE (mars_armer @ Nov 22 2006, 06:14 AM...   Mar 19 2007, 10:11 AM
- - lyford   hmmm - i didn't realize that the plan was to l...   Nov 21 2006, 08:57 PM
- - nprev   Very cool indeed, but I sure hope they don't p...   Nov 22 2006, 04:46 AM
- - MarkL   Nice video. Agreed, Lyford. I think they are nut...   Nov 22 2006, 06:55 PM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (MarkL @ Nov 22 2006, 01:55 PM) The...   Nov 22 2006, 07:41 PM
|- - helvick   QUOTE (centsworth_II @ Nov 22 2006, 07:41...   Nov 22 2006, 08:53 PM
|- - tty   QUOTE (helvick @ Nov 22 2006, 09:53 PM) T...   Nov 23 2006, 06:56 PM
- - remcook   "I think they are nuts to depart from the pro...   Nov 22 2006, 07:14 PM
- - lyford   Scaling up MER to MSL won't work with airbags ...   Nov 22 2006, 07:55 PM
- - djellison   If you describe to yourself the process of the MPF...   Nov 22 2006, 08:11 PM
|- - lyford   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 22 2006, 12:11 PM)...   Nov 22 2006, 10:29 PM
|- - centsworth_II   QUOTE (djellison @ Nov 22 2006, 03:11 PM)...   Nov 23 2006, 11:58 AM
|- - ustrax   QUOTE (centsworth_II @ Nov 23 2006, 11:58...   Nov 23 2006, 12:25 PM
- - MarkL   Check out this article if interested in more detai...   Nov 23 2006, 04:13 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (MarkL @ Nov 23 2006, 04:13 PM) Dou...   Nov 23 2006, 04:57 PM
- - edstrick   they often have duplicate circuits for really crit...   Nov 24 2006, 11:59 AM
|- - JTN   It's going to be funny to look back and see ro...   Nov 25 2006, 01:22 AM
- - Jeff7   QUOTE The cord cutting event does look awfully ris...   Nov 25 2006, 01:36 AM
- - nprev   Hmm...curious, but probably wise for a mass audien...   Mar 16 2007, 04:24 AM
- - gpurcell   Sure gives a sense of just how radical the Skycran...   Mar 16 2007, 03:19 PM
- - As old as Voyager   Upon seeing the MSL rover in simulations I'm a...   Mar 17 2007, 11:51 AM
- - gpurcell   Oh, and I forgot to mention that I love the Firefl...   Mar 19 2007, 06:35 PM
- - Toma B   Just find this... Mars Science Laboratory Mission ...   May 30 2007, 07:30 AM
- - nprev   Thanks, Toma! Man...LOTS of moving parts on...   May 30 2007, 10:55 AM
- - Toma B   I like that Hollywood-style action camera movement...   May 30 2007, 12:00 PM
- - Stu   Just watched the animation (a loooong download on ...   May 30 2007, 01:35 PM
|- - gallen_53   QUOTE (Stu @ May 30 2007, 01:35 PM) Watch...   May 30 2007, 04:00 PM
|- - AlexBlackwell   QUOTE (gallen_53 @ May 30 2007, 06:00 AM)...   May 30 2007, 04:31 PM
|- - gallen_53   QUOTE (AlexBlackwell @ May 30 2007, 04:31...   May 30 2007, 04:47 PM
|- - AlexBlackwell   QUOTE (gallen_53 @ May 30 2007, 06:47 AM)...   May 30 2007, 05:41 PM
|- - gallen_53   QUOTE (AlexBlackwell @ May 30 2007, 05:41...   May 30 2007, 06:56 PM
- - RedSky   The whole suspend and release process really scare...   May 30 2007, 03:20 PM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (RedSky @ May 30 2007, 04:20 PM) On...   May 30 2007, 04:01 PM
||- - gallen_53   QUOTE (djellison @ May 30 2007, 04:01 PM)...   May 30 2007, 04:13 PM
|- - Jim from NSF.com   QUOTE (RedSky @ May 30 2007, 11:20 AM) I ...   May 31 2007, 12:00 AM
- - Juramike   Is there any possibility of mounting instrumentati...   May 30 2007, 07:30 PM
|- - Jim from NSF.com   QUOTE (Juramike @ May 30 2007, 03:30 PM) ...   May 30 2007, 11:52 PM
|- - Toma B   QUOTE (Jim from NSF.com @ May 31 2007, 01...   May 31 2007, 07:08 AM
|- - mchan   B)-->QUOTE(Toma B @ May 31 2007, 12:08 AM...   Jun 1 2007, 03:29 AM
- - dvandorn   Jim, I think the suggestion is that the descent st...   May 30 2007, 11:59 PM
|- - hendric   QUOTE (dvandorn @ May 30 2007, 06:59 PM) ...   May 31 2007, 04:48 AM
- - Jim from NSF.com   Any residual propellant or products could contamin...   May 31 2007, 11:52 AM
- - djellison   I think the MSL decent stage will be given the sam...   May 31 2007, 12:55 PM
- - dvandorn   As long as MSL has a laser and not an ACME disinte...   Jun 1 2007, 03:43 AM
- - Ron Hobbs   New animations have been posted. They look pretty ...   Jun 25 2011, 12:13 AM
- - djellison   Wow - time warp thread. Who would have thought I...   Jun 25 2011, 12:52 AM
- - charborob   Is that Gale crater in the animation? Also, too ba...   Jun 25 2011, 01:21 AM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (charborob @ Jun 24 2011, 06:21 PM)...   Jun 25 2011, 03:20 AM
|- - Explorer1   I do see a dust devil at one point; at least that...   Jun 25 2011, 03:37 AM
- - KrisK   Fantastic!!! I noticed that just befor...   Jun 25 2011, 02:49 AM
- - eoincampbell   Is a certain direction and distance from Curiosity...   Jun 25 2011, 03:43 AM
- - djellison   QUOTE (Explorer1 @ Jun 24 2011, 07:37 PM)...   Jun 25 2011, 04:12 AM
- - elakdawalla   QUOTE (charborob @ Jun 24 2011, 05:21 PM)...   Jun 25 2011, 04:56 AM
|- - djellison   QUOTE (elakdawalla @ Jun 24 2011, 09:56 P...   Jun 25 2011, 05:11 AM
- - eoincampbell   Cheers Doug, thanks for the link, lots of Curious ...   Jun 25 2011, 05:02 AM
- - Explorer1   Well, MSL could do a nice hardware survey like wit...   Jun 25 2011, 06:07 AM
- - djellison   Not of the descent stage. It will have leaked hydr...   Jun 25 2011, 06:16 AM
|- - tbruckner   Very nice animation. One question: shortly before ...   Jun 25 2011, 11:56 AM
- - Astro0   From the document posted by djellison above... pag...   Jun 25 2011, 12:16 PM
- - nprev   VERY nice animation, Doug. Kay & I just watche...   Jun 25 2011, 04:45 PM
- - Oersted   I remember discussing the fate of the skycrane wit...   Jun 27 2011, 12:47 AM
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