My Assistant
GIGANTIC Aviation Week story, Pentagon has been flying 2-stage orbital spaceplane throughout 1990s |
| Guest_BruceMoomaw_* |
Mar 6 2006, 02:24 AM
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#1
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Guests |
It may even have been manned:
http://www.aviationnow.com/avnow/news/chan...ws/030606p1.xml My God, what a story -- if it's even partially true. And, judging from this article, they are absolutely certain they have proof (along with proof that the thing, although it works, has recently been mothballed as not cost-effective). It's important to keep in mind, though, that this thing is NOT a workable prototype of the originally planned 2-stage winged Space Shuttle. The second stage -- the spaceplane that actually achieved orbit -- was relatively small and probably very inefficient as a cargo carrier; its advantage lay in allowing the US to get a military reconaissance (or weapons) satellite into orbit surreptitiously, with no advance warning of the launch going to other countries. Even at that, as I say, AW reports that the thing has been recently canned as not worth its (doubtless huge) black-budget expense. |
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| Guest_BruceMoomaw_* |
Mar 11 2006, 11:31 AM
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#2
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Bell, having now read the two other Aviation Week stories on this subject, has developed a new theory of what the eyewitnesses were really seeing:
"The second article on the orbiter has a detailed description of the vehicle as seen by an F-15 pilot at Holloman AFB (NM). He describes the four main engine exhausts as having a gridlike or 'radiator' appearance. "Now this is not typical of aerospikes or any rocket engine. But the air intakes on the F-117 do have grids over them to keep radars from seeing the compressor blades (which give a strong radar return and a distinctive modulation). "So, if one was designing a high-subsonic or transsonic stealth recon plane, one might well use grids to keep radars or IR systems from looking up the tailpipe and seeing the turbine blades. Probably there would still be a narrow spike of high detectability along the thrust axis, but with a little care this axis will never point directly at a ground radar or hostile aircraft. "This article also describes two circular ports flanking the engines and white cylindrical objects seen on the ramp alongside the 'spacecraft'. AvWeek interprets these as solid-fuel booster rockets that fit into the stern ports. "But a stealthy recon plane might want to shoot missiles backwards at a pursuing fighter. There is a naval version of the Sparrow/AIM-120 family that steers by vectored thrust at low airspeeds. With a little work it could steer at negative airspeeds. Back in the late 50s the Navy worked on backward firing missiles for P6M and possibly A3D. "So if there is any truth to this story at all, I think it refers to a super-stealthy but otherwise conventional peacetime strategic recon aircraft that sneaks over key sites between passes by imaging satellites. This operational concept makes far more sense than the blatantly obvious orbital or boost-glide scenario advocated by AvWeek. "Holloman would be a logical emergency landing site for this aircraft because it hosts the F-117 wing and has a lot of secure hangars: http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.asp...man+AFB%7cnm%7c "The third article about the 'Mothership' is less convincing. The author claims that many reports of B-70ish aircraft have been sent to AvWeek, but the only one he describes in detail is ludicrous. An 'experienced birdwatcher' in Pennsylvania claims that a Mothership flew by her house at only 2500' AGL, lit off its afterburners, and climbed away with tremendous noise. Sure seems like a top-secret operation, doesn't it?" |
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Mar 11 2006, 11:37 AM
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#3
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2488 Joined: 17-April 05 From: Glasgow, Scotland, UK Member No.: 239 |
Is it a bad sign when Jeffrey Bell starts agreeing with me?
I may have to go and lie down. Bob Shaw -------------------- Remember: Time Flies like the wind - but Fruit Flies like bananas!
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Mar 12 2006, 02:23 AM
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#4
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Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 242 Joined: 21-December 04 Member No.: 127 |
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BruceMoomaw GIGANTIC Aviation Week story Mar 6 2006, 02:24 AM
tasp QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 5 2006, 08:24 PM... Mar 6 2006, 02:56 AM
mcaplinger Interesting, but I don't think AW&ST's... Mar 6 2006, 02:58 AM
BruceMoomaw Whatever happened to the "donuts on a rope... Mar 6 2006, 03:44 AM
deglr6328 Completely fascinating. Virtually all the details... Mar 6 2006, 06:30 AM
Bob Shaw Jeffrey Bell is really worried about the threat fr... Mar 6 2006, 11:44 AM
BruceMoomaw Jeffrey Bell, that eternal party-pooper, caught no... Mar 6 2006, 07:54 AM
paxdan The set up described reminds me of the Tagboard pr... Mar 6 2006, 11:37 AM
tty Actually this is a rather typical Jeff Bell effort... Mar 6 2006, 07:56 PM
Myran Thats very insightful deglr6328, and without enoug... Mar 6 2006, 11:36 AM
edstrick ET Phone Area-51?
Actually, I've recently rea... Mar 6 2006, 12:00 PM
Bob Shaw Here are grabs from the AW&ST website:
http:/... Mar 6 2006, 01:25 PM
Ames Where does the undercarriage go?
doesn't ... Mar 6 2006, 02:16 PM
BruceMoomaw QUOTE (tty @ Mar 6 2006, 07:56 PM) Fortun... Mar 6 2006, 10:53 PM
BruceMoomaw Footnote: the Titan 2 second stage weighed 29,000 ... Mar 6 2006, 11:15 PM
tasp QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 6 2006, 05:15 PM... Mar 7 2006, 02:59 AM
Bob Shaw QUOTE (tasp @ Mar 7 2006, 02:59 AM) We ca... Mar 7 2006, 10:23 AM
Bob Shaw One *possible* vehicle which may form part of a so... Mar 7 2006, 04:36 PM
tty Well, I’ve been doing some more figuring and I mus... Mar 7 2006, 08:43 PM
dvandorn Just a little gedankenexperiment, here -- anyone c... Mar 7 2006, 09:48 PM
AlexBlackwell QUOTE (dvandorn @ Mar 7 2006, 09:48 PM) J... Mar 7 2006, 09:57 PM
Bob Shaw QUOTE (dvandorn @ Mar 7 2006, 09:48 PM) J... Mar 7 2006, 10:08 PM
JTN QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 7 2006, 10:08 PM) C... Mar 7 2006, 10:44 PM
dvandorn Good point, Alex -- NRO probably would run such an... Mar 7 2006, 10:02 PM
dvandorn I'm not trying to imply conspiracies -- though... Mar 7 2006, 10:32 PM
dvandorn I have to admit, when I saw the Blackstar story, t... Mar 7 2006, 10:57 PM
BruceMoomaw According to the article, not even the nation... Mar 8 2006, 01:26 AM
GregM So let’s see here. To start with we have the Valky... Mar 8 2006, 04:02 AM
tty Also remember that there is a school of thought th... Mar 8 2006, 07:24 AM
paxdan Lots of info about the XB-70 What an aircraft... Mar 8 2006, 09:58 AM
Bob Shaw Jim Oberg on MSNBC.Com Space News summed up the Bo... Mar 8 2006, 11:09 AM
Steve G QUOTE (paxdan @ Mar 8 2006, 02:58 AM) Lot... Mar 17 2006, 02:56 AM
GregM QUOTE (Steve G @ Mar 17 2006, 02:56 AM) I... Mar 17 2006, 03:45 AM
dvandorn In re the Avro Arrow:
QUOTE (GregM @ Mar 16 ... Mar 18 2006, 03:19 PM
Steve G QUOTE (dvandorn @ Mar 18 2006, 08:19 AM) ... Mar 18 2006, 09:03 PM
BruceMoomaw It should be remembered that there is still -- to ... Mar 8 2006, 11:04 AM
paxdan QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 8 2006, 11:04 AM... Mar 8 2006, 11:11 AM
tty [quote name='BruceMoomaw' date='Mar 8 ... Mar 8 2006, 11:18 PM
gndonald QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 8 2006, 07:04 PM... Mar 17 2006, 04:14 PM
Bob Shaw QUOTE (gndonald @ Mar 17 2006, 04:14 PM) ... Mar 17 2006, 08:40 PM
ljk4-1 QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 17 2006, 03:40 PM) ... Mar 17 2006, 09:38 PM
edstrick I believe "AirCraftFilms", the companion... Mar 8 2006, 12:41 PM
BruceMoomaw QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 8 2006, 11:09 AM) J... Mar 8 2006, 01:27 PM
ljk4-1 I found this post from the FPSPACE list very inter... Mar 8 2006, 02:49 PM
AlexBlackwell QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 8 2006, 01:27 PM... Mar 8 2006, 04:48 PM
BruceMoomaw QUOTE (AlexBlackwell @ Mar 8 2006, 04:48 ... Mar 9 2006, 12:39 AM
ljk4-1 It is a known fact that the CIA and USSR "sup... Mar 9 2006, 03:56 PM
AlexBlackwell QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 9 2006, 12:39 AM... Mar 9 2006, 04:55 PM
BruceMoomaw Okay, but a magazine which (according to you) is c... Mar 9 2006, 09:17 PM
AlexBlackwell QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 9 2006, 09:17 PM... Mar 9 2006, 09:32 PM
BruceMoomaw QUOTE (AlexBlackwell @ Mar 9 2006, 09:32 ... Mar 10 2006, 05:24 AM
Bob Shaw From Wikipedia:
"One notable variant of the ... Mar 10 2006, 09:46 AM
ljk4-1 Blackstar: False Messiah From Groom Lake
http://w... Mar 10 2006, 12:16 PM
tty Here it is Jeff Bell who is off speculating in the... Mar 12 2006, 04:45 PM
Bob Shaw QUOTE (tty @ Mar 12 2006, 04:45 PM) If yo... Mar 12 2006, 09:17 PM
ljk4-1 Six blind men in a zoo: Aviation Week's mythic... Mar 13 2006, 05:13 PM
AlexBlackwell QUOTE (ljk4-1 @ Mar 13 2006, 05:13 P... Mar 13 2006, 05:25 PM
helvick QUOTE (AlexBlackwell @ Mar 13 2006, 05:25... Mar 13 2006, 06:04 PM
gpurcell Ouch, that's GOTTA hurt. Mar 13 2006, 07:01 PM
tty Just one small point. That nuclear-powered soviet ... Mar 13 2006, 07:05 PM
ljk4-1 This Web page has excerpts from the 1958 AW&ST... Mar 13 2006, 07:29 PM
Myran Two US built nuclear jet engines at Idaho National... Mar 13 2006, 09:53 PM
BruceMoomaw Having finally read all of Dwayne Day's story,... Mar 18 2006, 03:51 AM
Bob Shaw QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 18 2006, 03:51 A... Mar 18 2006, 01:36 PM
gpurcell QUOTE (Bob Shaw @ Mar 18 2006, 01:36 PM) ... Mar 18 2006, 01:58 PM
BruceMoomaw QUOTE (gpurcell @ Mar 18 2006, 01:58 PM) ... Mar 19 2006, 01:16 AM
AlexBlackwell QUOTE (BruceMoomaw @ Mar 19 2006, 01:16 A... Mar 20 2006, 05:13 PM
ljk4-1 http://www.janes.com/defence/air_forces/ne...60406... Apr 12 2006, 06:23 PM
BruceMoomaw Four more Aviation Week letters on the BlackStar s... Apr 21 2006, 01:20 PM
tty Piggybacking on a B-70 would not be a good idea ae... Apr 21 2006, 05:07 PM
ljk4-1 Black projects don't seem to be having any bud... May 23 2006, 07:09 PM
climber I heard this week on the radio that the whole USA ... May 23 2006, 07:34 PM
ljk4-1 Looks like they had a plan similar to the one from... May 23 2006, 08:15 PM![]() ![]() |
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