[X] My Assistant

[MizarKey]

Let's get a look inside this cracked region 147.99°W 10.98°N

http://www.msss.com/moc_gallery/ab1_m04/images/M0403526.html also seen here http://www.msss.com/moc_gallery/m13_m18/im...8/M1800626.html and just missed here http://www.msss.com/moc_gallery/r10_r15/fu...14/R1400085.jpg

Doh! All this research and MOC already did a decent job in http://www.msss.com/moc_gallery/r03_r09/im...6/R0601894.html

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[babakm]

What's the scientific rational ( not saying there isn't one, you just didn't tell us )

Look up a few posts Doug.

[djellison]

Ahh right - I thought you were talking about something new

Doug

[algorimancer]

I would really enjoy seeing some good hires imagery of the Big Crater to the east of Victoria, particularly the west and south rims. Rationale being twofold, one to explore evidence of long ago surface water, particularly fossil shoreline and sediment - potentially mud cracks and eroded layering, and two as a long range target for Oppy.

Further, to quote Edward Schmitz, "The realy interesting thing about big crater, to me, is that it appears to predate the evaporite layers that opportunity has been investigating. The sediments seem to drap over the crater and the original rim is poking through in some spots. If we could investigate those peaks, we might see unaltered rock that pre-date the evaporite layers."

[mhoward]

I would really enjoy seeing some good hires imagery of the Big Crater to the east of Victoria, particularly the west and south rims.

Hear, hear. I second that.

[djellison]

The one we call Ithaca? About 15k ESE of Vic?

Doug

[tuvas]

I would really enjoy seeing some good hires imagery of the Big Crater to the east of Victoria, particularly the west and south rims.

Okay, I see 3 possible craters that could be what you are meaning, but I would need to know which one of the craters it is that you want specifically. , preferably long/lat to at least 1 decimal place, as well as references from large features nearby. Ie, one of the features is due east of Victoria, -2.1 , 354.5E. It is roughly parallel with the top of the large crater seen to the west. If you give me those kinds of details, I can add it. As for the rationale, here's what I will likely put:

The two main craters in this region are unusual, in that they appear to predate the evaporite layers that Opportunity has been investigating. Sediments seem to drape over the crater and the original rim is poking though in some spots. If we could investigate those peaks, we might see unaltered rock that pre-dates the evaporite layers.

[Stu]

Oh, if you guys include pretty exact locations and a scientific rationale, I might be able to sneak some of the targets into the suggestion database...

Okay, here I go...



Un-named Crater, Ganges Chasma

Location: 44.6 deg W 9 deg S

Rationale: to study 1) exposed deep layering in crater wall, 2) erosion features within crater, 3) landslides beneath crater that have spilled material into and across the valley floor and 4) because I love it, it got me "into" Mars all those years ago, and I want to see it through HiRise's eyes!

[algorimancer]

Okay, I see 3 possible craters that could be what you are meaning, but I would need to know which one of the craters it is that you want specifically. , preferably long/lat to at least 1 decimal place, as well as references from large features nearby. Ie, one of the features is due east of Victoria, -2.1 , 354.5E. It is roughly parallel with the top of the large crater seen to the west. If you give me those kinds of details, I can add it. As for the rationale, here's what I will likely put:

Big Crater is the crater which some folks on this site have referred to as "Ithaca", and it is located something like 15-20 kilometers to the southeast. Here is a link to the "Getting to Big Crater" thread,

http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=3215

Which hopefully makes it pretty obvious. I would like to give firmer lat/lon coordinates, but the only site that allows me that option (http://themis.asu.edu/mars-bin/webmap.pl) seems to be lacking its image database.

Here's a MOC pic that traverses it:

http://www.msss.com/moc_gallery/e07_e12/im...1/E1101328.html

And a context pic of its appearance from Victoria:

http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.p...ost&id=7781

Tim53 once told me that "The peaks on the north rim of the 21km crater are at 2.1S latitude, and 354.8 to 354.84 E longitude".

I hope that helps If you can point me to a reference where I could measure better coordinates I would be happy to do that.

[algorimancer]

Tuvas, I discovered that Nasa' Worldwind software has a Mars component which allows me to get coordinates.

A box which completely contains Big Crater spans
latitudes -2.07905 to -2.50224
longitudes -5.37642 to -4.95473 (WEST)

A minimal box covering the western and southern edges of the crater spans
latitudes -2.14700 to -2.50224
longitudes -5.37642 to -5.09448 (WEST)

And modifying your rationale slightly to fit the single crater becomes something like:

The main crater in this region is unusual, in that it appears to predate the evaporite layers that Opportunity has been investigating. Sediments seem to drape over the crater and the original rim is poking though in some spots. If we could investigate those peaks, we might see unaltered rock that pre-dates the evaporite layers.

I might also add that something like, "MOLA altimetry further indicates that the floor of the crater is substantially lower (~200 meters) than the region explored by Opportunity, and may preserve evidence of past standing water or ice contemporary with the deposition of evaporite layers elsewhere in Meridiani."

Thanks

[ngunn]

I'd like a picture to settle the question of whether that natural arch that was imaged early on really has a hole underneath. If it can't be viewed sufficiently obliquely then maybe a well timed shot with low angle illumination would do the trick? The rationale (apart from sheer curiosity)? Well it might give us information not easily gained otherwise about the mechanical strength of the Martian surface. Or it might show that permanently shaded places on Mars act as ice-traps or have colour differences or other peculiarities arising from shelter from UV and cosmic rays. The Martian caves have been proposed as possible refuges for life. Underneath an arch may not be quite as good a refuge but it is one step more accessible from an imaging point of view, even if still rather awkward.

[ustrax]

The one we call Ithaca? About 15k ESE of Vic?

Hi everyone!
I give my full support to that choice!

Big Crater is the crater which some folks on this site have referred to as "Ithaca", and it is located something like 15-20 kilometers to the southeast. Here is a link to the "Getting to Big Crater" thread

Let me just add that the referred thread was, in my oppinion, one of the most hilarious ever seen on this forum...
"Mad, mad, mad... you're all completely mad. I love it!"

[centsworth_II]

I give my full support to that choice!

And don't forget to include the area between Victoria and Ithaca
so that UMSFers can start mapping out rover routes!

[ustrax]

And don't forget to include the area between Victoria and Ithaca
so that UMSFers can start mapping out rover routes!

I'm starting to like this...
Rationale?...

[tuvas]

Silly me, I was looking the wrong direction, of course "Big Crater" would be big... Anyways, I've added it to the list of suggestions, but as a warning, there is over 10k suggestions, so it might be a while... Oddly enough there's hardly any suggestions in the area, only a handful...

Stu, I'd add yours, but it would be nice if you could give a concise science rational...

Thanks all for your help!