MSL Images & Cameras, technical discussions of images, image processing and cameras |
MSL Images & Cameras, technical discussions of images, image processing and cameras |
Sep 20 2012, 08:54 AM
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#121
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Member Group: Members Posts: 282 Joined: 18-June 04 Member No.: 84 |
Thanksfully, they didn't apply such a processing onto color pictures from Mastcam (general public can fin them too flat, or too red ) ! I was hoping they would increase the jpg quality of the color mastcam shots like they did with navcams, but the latest batch look even more highly compressed. |
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Sep 20 2012, 07:48 PM
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#122
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Member Group: Members Posts: 154 Joined: 19-September 12 Member No.: 6658 |
Couldn't find an answer so far - can please someone explain why the calibration target on MSL does not have a dustcover or some sort of dust removal technology? What did they calibrate for when all the grey and coloured patches are full of dust? Even here on earth a photographer has to buy a new greycard now and then (at least he should because of colour changing) ...
Thank you! |
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Sep 20 2012, 08:57 PM
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#123
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 2511 Joined: 13-September 05 Member No.: 497 |
can please someone explain why the calibration target on MSL does not have a dustcover or some sort of dust removal technology? http://www.nbi.ku.dk/english/research/phd_...011/line_drube/ QUOTE Permanent ring-magnets have also been built into the calibration target of the Mars Science Laboratory (MSL), the same type of ring-magnet used in the Sweep magnet experiment on the Mars Exploration Rovers (MERs). Unfortunately, on MSL the ring-magnets were included at a very late stage in the development of the target (actually the target was a flight spare unit from the MER mission). This resulted in the ring-magnets being positioned at a depth of 0.8-1.0 mm below the surface instead of the 0.4 mm used on the MERs and Phoenix. From preliminary computer simulations this didn't appear to make a significant difference, other than in the size of the magnetically protected area. However, wind tunnel experiments using Salten Skov dust have now demonstrated that this relatively small difference in depth causes the "protected" area to disappear, so that with this new configuration the ring center will accumulate more dust than the reference areas free of influence from any magnetic field. With no clean area at all, magnets in this configuration will have the opposite effect to what they were intended to provide, attracting significant amounts of dust and retaining it on areas that are meant to be used as "dust-free" calibration standards. -------------------- Disclaimer: This post is based on public information only. Any opinions are my own.
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Sep 21 2012, 06:09 AM
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#124
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Member Group: Members Posts: 154 Joined: 19-September 12 Member No.: 6658 |
Thank you for the link. Two more:
The combined CalTarget and iSweep experiment Magnetic properties experiments [...] Design, calibration, and science goals Quote form the second link: QUOTE From this we have concluded that essentially all particles in the Martian atmosphere are magnetic in the sense that they are attracted to permanent magnets. Too bad it didn't work now on MSL. Edit: Interesting lecture video from Morten Bo Madsen unfortunately in danish |
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Sep 22 2012, 01:17 PM
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#125
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Junior Member Group: Members Posts: 40 Joined: 29-December 11 Member No.: 6295 |
How can I demosaic the bayer filter treated Curiosity raw images ? Is there any appropriate software known ?
Regards, Udo -------------------- But to be a lament on the lips of the loved one is glorious, For the prosaic goes toneless to Orcus below. (Friedrich Schiller: Naenie)
Home of marspages.eu and plutoidenpages.eu |
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Sep 22 2012, 01:47 PM
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#126
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Chief Assistant Group: Admin Posts: 1409 Joined: 5-January 05 From: Ierapetra, Greece Member No.: 136 |
You can download GIMP (GIMP.org) and the plugin G'MIC(G'MIC) ..
then after opening the file in GIMP; Filters > G'MIC(new window) > Degradations > Bayer reconstruction -------------------- photographer, space imagery enthusiast, proud father and partner, and geek.
http://500px.com/sacred-photons & |
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Sep 22 2012, 03:43 PM
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#127
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Junior Member Group: Members Posts: 40 Joined: 29-December 11 Member No.: 6295 |
Thanks-a-lot. Works ! Regards Udo -------------------- But to be a lament on the lips of the loved one is glorious, For the prosaic goes toneless to Orcus below. (Friedrich Schiller: Naenie)
Home of marspages.eu and plutoidenpages.eu |
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Sep 22 2012, 08:10 PM
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#128
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1465 Joined: 9-February 04 From: Columbus OH USA Member No.: 13 |
How would the night sky look at Gale Crater? Would the Milky Way be a magnificent sight, or might there be too much dust aloft to have a good view?
I was wondering if the mastcam az/el motors are up to the task of tracking a long exposure shot of the night sky. -------------------- |
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Sep 22 2012, 08:20 PM
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#129
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 3516 Joined: 4-November 05 From: North Wales Member No.: 542 |
I'll go with 'magnificent'. Dust isn't a problem if there's nothing lighting it up. Maybe the stars are only half as bright as from out in space (not a big difference really) but the background is still black. I wish the view from my back yard was that good.
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Sep 22 2012, 08:42 PM
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#130
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Member Group: Members Posts: 178 Joined: 13-September 05 Member No.: 498 |
I was wondering if the mastcam az/el motors are up to the task of tracking a long exposure shot of the night sky. I was wondering whether - in another year or so - a long-exposure shot of Jupiter with the M100 would look good. Of course, we can get superb shots of Jupiter from other hardware, so it would be a bit of a vanity exercise, but interesting nonetheless. And it might give some indirect information about the state of the Martian night atmosphere or some other subtle data. |
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Sep 22 2012, 09:40 PM
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#131
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 4246 Joined: 17-January 05 Member No.: 152 |
There was lots of night imaging from Spirit of course. They didn't image the Milky Way, but did image the LMC. One potential problem with MSL is bandpass. The good results from Spirit used the L1 (open) pancam. I believe that has considerably wider bandpass than L0/R0 on mastcam, which has an IR cutoff (cutting above around 700 nm). I'm not sure how important the IR is to imaging the night sky, but that could mean you'd need substantially longer exposures with mastcam. But the efficiency of the detector and speed of the optical system also matters of course. And look at the Spirit images - CCD noise becomes important on long exposures.
As far as tracking, I think that's out. Even if they could manage to move the mast at the extremely slow rate you'd need while taking an exposure, it's an altazimuth mount so frame rotation quickly becomes a problem. Probably better to take multiple short exposures and stack them (with rotation to compensate for field rotation if needed). Tau is important. The absorption when tau is high means you need longer exposures, which is always harder. I think dust would affect the visibility of diffuse objects like the Milky Way more than stars. Maybe if heating needs aren't too bad, they could do night imaging in the low-tau winter, which they could never do with MER. |
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Sep 23 2012, 11:50 AM
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#132
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1084 Joined: 19-February 05 From: Close to Meudon Observatory in France Member No.: 172 |
Thank you for the link. Two more: The combined CalTarget and iSweep experiment Too bad it didn't work now on MSL. Well... Those experiments are too much "combined" on the MSL for my own color calibration tests... The 4 color calibration targets are now "polluted" by the magnet experiments... See sections from MastCam Sol 13 vs. Sol 44 image. It's a real pity... And even more than a pity. This was a foreseen event as per page 58 of the "Martian Airborne Dust - Magnetic Properties on Phoenix and Dust on the MSL Calibration Target " thesis by Line Drube in 2011 : http://www.nbi.ku.dk/english/research/phd_...e_juni2011.pdf/ "It is apparent from Figure 50 that keeping the magnets in the MSL calibration target will quickly ruin much of the blue, green, yellow and red colored calibration areas for their intended purpose. Since less than a year to launch is too late for removing the magnets from the calibration target..." |
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Sep 23 2012, 02:02 PM
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#133
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Junior Member Group: Members Posts: 31 Joined: 10-August 12 Member No.: 6526 |
As far as tracking, I think that's out. Even if they could manage to move the mast at the extremely slow rate you'd need while taking an exposure, it's an altazimuth mount so frame rotation quickly becomes a problem. Probably better to take multiple short exposures and stack them (with rotation to compensate for field rotation if needed). Curiosity is currently at 4.5 degrees south latitude. If you could cant the rover by that amount in the north-south direction, then the masthead should be able to track objects on the sky's equator by simply adjusting altitude only without any field rotation. Hopefully, the minimum altitude increment of the masthead would shift the image by less than a pixel. Mark P.S. I wonder if MAHLI could be used? The arm has so many degrees of freedom that something should be possible for proper tracking. Looking at the arm I think you would still need to cant the rover, but at least you could track objects at different declinations on the sky by adjusting the last axis on the arm. Tracking would be done with the second to last axis. Question again would be if the pointing accuracy is good enough? |
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Sep 23 2012, 04:51 PM
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#134
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 4246 Joined: 17-January 05 Member No.: 152 |
The problem is precision. I'd be surprized if MC or MH could slew slowly enough to track the sky, which is about 4 seconds per arcminute. Both MC34 and MH have resolutions of around 1 arcmin/px. So you'd either need to bump something like 1 arcmin every 4 seconds, which is an incredibly fine step, or slew at an extremely slow continuous rate. Either is way outside what they were built to do. And I don't know if you could both move and shoot at the same time to begin with.
But the good news is optical speed. MER pancam is f/20, and still we could image the LMC! MH is f/8.5 and MC34 f/8. So in terms of optics alone, you'd need roughly a sixth of the exposure compared with pancam. (Even MC100 is f/10.) So stacking a series of short exposures might give very impressive results. (But there's still the lower optical bandwidth for mastcam compared with pancam.) |
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Sep 23 2012, 05:58 PM
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#135
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1465 Joined: 9-February 04 From: Columbus OH USA Member No.: 13 |
I'd be surprized if MC or MH could slew slowly enough to track the sky, which is about 4 seconds per arcminute. For the case of MC, found a reference: The Mars Science Laboratory Engineering Cameras QUOTE The absolute pointing accuracy of the RSM is approximately 4.6 milliradians (approximately 6 Navcam pixels), and pointing is repeatable to less than a Navcam pixel. So that would be about 15 MC pixels--not so great for tracking the sky then. -------------------- |
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