UnmannedSpaceflight.com and The Planetary Society, "A match made in the heavens" Options

[elakdawalla]

I, along with the rest of the admin team here at UnmannedSpaceflight.com have a big announcment to make today: The Planetary Society and UnmannedSpaceflight.com are joining forces. Here's the Society's press release about it. I'm so excited! You guys with your fantastic work processing space images are exactly the kind of people we seek to connect with, inspire, educate, and in turn, see you educating everyone around you about what's going on in the exploration of our solar system.

Some of you may be a little concerned about this new partnership -- you may be thinking that the Planetary Society will try to change the way the forum is run. Let me assure you that that will not happen. My bosses at the Society recognize that the reason this place is so great is that it is a community that has grown around itself, developed its own rules, and is functioning very well on its own terms. The administrative policies will not change. All that is changing is that the Society is agreeing to be responsible for the financial maintenance of the website; and that when you make donations to support this site, your donations are tax-deductible (at least in the U.S).

If you have any questions or concerns about this new collaboration, please do not hesitate to ask me or any other member of the admin/mod team.

[ngunn]

Hooray!

[stevesliva]

Nice! Not at all concerned about the site content and moderation. Happy to have it under some auspices of the Planetary Society.

My only really minor concern is some consideration about hosting this forum with little downtime. I seem to recall planetary.org having some issues in the past, but I have no idea of why-- whether it was a 3rd party hosting issue, or whether it was internal DIY gone awry. But umsf has long been very well admin'ed from a technical standpoint, and I'd love to see that continue.

[brellis]

yay!

[elakdawalla]

That's a good question. UMSF will stay on its current dedicated server. It's had such a good uptime record, maybe we should move the Society's homepage to the same server

(Society's downtime is almost always related to enormous mission events, where servers suddenly get hammered. We're supposed to be robust to those things but the web service providers can't always tell the difference between a really really big mission event that triggers lots of page views of one image, and a DOS attack.)

[jasedm]

So, business as usual, but TPS picks up the tab? Am I reading that right?

I like the idea that some of the very hard work put in by the likes of Bjorn, Machi, Exploitcorporations, Ian R et al gain a wider audience - richly deserved I think.

Jase

[elakdawalla]

Well, sort of. Remember that the Society is an organization whose funds come from dues and donations. USMF has, in the past, been funded by its members (it isn't really very expensive -- the main expense is the huge amount of time donated by the all-volunteer admin team). That won't change -- it's just that instead of sending a Paypal donation to some random British guy (hi Doug!), it's now being done through a nonprofit with all the i's dotted and T's crossed.

[nprev]

Great, and I might say rather unexpected, news! Makes all kinds of sense on lots of levels...good thinking!!!

Emily, let me get this straight, though: Should we donate to UMSF as before, or will there be a dedicated UMSF donation method offered via TPS, or will TPS fund UMSF so that donations to the former are used (in part) to fund the latter?

Just want to get it all right.

Also, do you happen to know if TPS is on the Combined Federal Campaign (CFC) this year? I looked for it in the pamphlet but didn't see it; entered the code from last year anyhow, hoping for the best...

[ElkGroveDan]

Give us another day Nick to get the donation buttons at the bottom sorted out.

[SFJCody]

Great, and I might say rather unexpected, news!

I anticipated it. So many references to UMSF.com in Emily's blog, so many member produced images on the Planetary Society website, so much cross-fertilization... it was only a matter of time. May this be a long and fruitful partnership!

[elakdawalla]

Nick: I've sent an email to ask about the CFC.

[nprev]

Cool; thanks, Emily. Dan (and I suspect Astro0), I see that the banner has already been revised...quick work, looks nice!

[djellison]

We must have been talking about this for 8 or 9 months, but I'm very very glad we're finally able to make it official. Thanks to all the admins and mods for being the sage sounding board they always are. Ever since I discovered I would be working at JPL - I wanted to hand the forum over to a safe pair of hands, and there are none safer than Emily's.

The combination of www.AmateurSpaceImages.com and UMSF coming under the TPS banner is just a match made in digital heaven. Thanks to Jen, Lou, Bill and most of all Emily for making it happen.

The Saturday before DPS in Cambridge 2005 - I met Steve Squyres for the first time, that awesome first interview MP3. The following day, I met Emily for the first time and suggested she would make an awesome admin for UMSF.

Today at DPS in 2010 - 5 years later - UMSF becomes a part of a very special society, and the opportunity to turn this bar-room brawl into a searchable usable resource finally comes to fruition.

And how did I end the day? Passing Steve in the corridor at DPS ( on the only night he's there ) and was able to share the good news with him.

[eoincampbell]

Congratulations!
Great news for the solar system (and beyond)...

[nprev]

Today at DPS in 2010 - 5 years later - UMSF becomes a part of a very special society, and the opportunity to turn this bar-room brawl into a searchable usable resource finally comes to fruition.

It's a beautiful vision of the future, but please: Leave just a little sawdust on the floor?

[djellison]

Oh - we still leave the sawdust on the floor here - but then all the good ideas written on the back of beer-mats get pinned up next door for everyone to enjoy

[Greg Hullender]

So contributions will be tax-deductible at last!

--Greg

[elakdawalla]

Yes indeed!

[Tom Tamlyn]

>>Ever since I discovered I would be working at JPL

Hello -- did I miss an announcement somewhere?

And congratulations to all on the new joint venture!

TTT

[djellison]

Hello -- did I miss an announcement somewhere?

I just let the news seep out by osmosis - I've been there since May

[Tom Tamlyn]

A second round of congratulations are in order. That's a big change. I guess it will no longer be strictly accurate to call you a spokesman for the amateur community. ->

Can you share what you're doing there, or will that just seep out too.

TTT

[djellison]

It'll seep out in about 3 weeks

[brellis]

It's quite refreshing to hear encouraging stories involving seepage!

[SFJCody]

Hello -- did I miss an announcement somewhere?

It pays to follow Doug on twitter!

[climber]

Great new indeed!
Doug, on my UMSF profile, can you change "joined 2006" by "joined 1989" please ?

[CosmicRocker]

Interesting news on both accounts. Congratulations all around.

This also reminded me that it has been a while since I donated to UMSF. I took care of that tonight, thanks to the new link at the bottom of the page.

Let's wish the best to our new proprietors.

[remcook]

sweet

[Stephen]

Some of you may be a little concerned about this new partnership -- you may be thinking that the Planetary Society will try to change the way the forum is run. Let me assure you that that will not happen. My bosses at the Society recognize that the reason this place is so great is that it is a community that has grown around itself, developed its own rules, and is functioning very well on its own terms. The administrative policies will not change.

Congratulations and best wishes.

But I do have a question or two: are these new arrangements in writing? What actual guarantees are there that the reassurances you gave will in fact remain in place over the longer term?

I ask that as someone who has been through more than one amalgamation himself. My experience of such things is that previous arrangements never remain the same after the big change, especially over the longer term.

More specifically, bosses change. When that happens anything that's not nailed down in writing has a habit of going out the window. There is always someone with a bright idea who believes his way of doing things is better than the way his predecessor(s) went about them. For example, recently a whole slew of bosses got turfed put where I come from and a brand-new management team brought in, a team which then proceeded to make wholesale changes to the way things were run, causing vast amounts of angst and gnashing of teeth in the process, at least among those who had no say themselves in the running of things. The point of view at the top was that they were only proceeding in what they saw as everybody's best interests, but it would be equally fair to say that among the lower echelons the general view was very different. Morale plummeted, and more than one decided they would have a better future elsewhere.

In that context I cannot help but notice that it wasn't Doug who made this announcement but Emily. That in itself would seem to be saying something.

That said, let me again say best wishes. I look forward to seeing what the Brave New World looks like.

=====
Stephen

[Bill Harris]

Unfortunately, the conversation has become so restricted/directed that you've missed many important geological/morphological features on the traverses. But you do have pretty pictures.

Good luck...

--Bill

[Juramike]

Awesome!

[Poolio]

Sounds great! If ever there were a match made in heaven, this is it.

Will membership dues and donations to TPS help cover the cost of UMSF, or will it still be required to fund UMSF separately? Not trying to save a few bucks here, just wondering... After all, these two websites account for the bulk of my internet time every day.

[Guest_Lunik9_*]

TPS has a nice logo... it's a match made in outer space
Seriously will http://planetary.org/amateur/index.html also include a gallery with magazine covers & newspaper articles provided by UMSF forum members?

[elakdawalla]

Stephen, there is a written agreement that outlines the boundaries between the Society and UnmannedSpaceflight.com. It's true that bosses change, and that admins and mods may come and go, but the admin team is the same as it was the day before yesterday and none of us anticipates it changing much any time soon. I'll be honest, nobody else who is employed by the Society even reads this forum, but everyone there is delighted to see the beautiful images that I pull out of it to show them.

Nick, I've confirmed that we are participating in the CFC this year, but I haven't heard back on my double-check of the specific code yet.

Lunik9, there probably wouldn't be a separate gallery for such images, but certainly it could be noted in image captions (and with a tag) if an image has been published somewhere.

[PDP8E]

Emily,
...by any chance did he transfer the title, 'dictator for life of unmannedspaceflight.com' ?

Oh well! Doug is extremely lucky, you are very lucky, and we all are just lucky to be here!

Good Luck to us all (!!) ... PDP8e

[ngunn]

I have expressed here before my belief that the origin and evolution of UnmannedSpaceflight.com is a piece of history in it's own right deserving of preservation as a "world heritage site". Future historians of science, of public participation in science, and of the role of the internet therein will find it an invaluable case study. I hope that one of the things the Planetary Society will now do is to archive a copy of the whole contents of the forum up to this point, entirely independent from the server on which it runs.

[nprev]

Thanks, Emily. Please let me know when you get the code; want to verify that my donation's going to the correct place!

[Pertinax]

I'm a bit slow to post here and as such my apologies !

That said, CONGRATULATIONS to you Doug and I can't wait to hear more of your role at JPL. I'll admit that I'm even more excited about that bit of news than the pleasant news that UMSF has comfortable and hopefully safe home with the PS. (One more inch closer in being drug kicking and screaming toward twitter.) Thank you Emily for your efforts !

While not a prolific poster, I love UMSF!


Cheers!



-- Pertinax

[ustrax]

sniff...and to think that yesterday this baby was giving its first steps...sniff
What a ride my friends, w-h-a-t a r-i-d-e ! ! !

[hendric]

Great news!

Re: Ngunn's proposal

How about we just archive the site and place it on the DVDs along with all the names TPS collects for planetary missions? Would be a great way to archive the site for the future!

[elakdawalla]

Also, do you happen to know if TPS is on the Combined Federal Campaign (CFC) this year? I looked for it in the pamphlet but didn't see it; entered the code from last year anyhow, hoping for the best...

The code is 53736 -- hope that's what you entered!

[nprev]

We have a winner!!! Yep, that was it, same as last year. Thanks, Emily!

[NW71]

I'm sure there has been far more work behind the scenes to make this happen than people are modestly coming clean about so many congratulations to all.

To Emily and all the other administrators - you can feel a real warm glow of pride with this news at a job well done.

Doug - many congratulations on your 'new' job. It must be a dream come true.

Now if JPL just needed an accountant/statistician...

Neil

[ups]

Doug, your little project here has become quite successful over the years -- congratulations.

[lyford]

Man I go off the grid for a few weeks and what happens?!?!?

HOORAY and HUZZAH! This is great news all around...

[JohnVV]

i guess it is about time to re register at the planetary Society
it has been about 20 years since i was getting the" planetary report " in the mail

[brellis]

Reading through UMSF threads and trying to figure out what the heck y'all are talking about is always a bright moment in my day.

This thread is making good sense to me!

Oh, and I am a proud member of the Planetary Society, just got my Volume XXX Report yesterday.

[John Macco]

As a lurker for 7 years, I thought I'd post my thoughts. I have been following the unmanned missions since the Mariner-2 days and I always thought the technicians and scientists who plan and execute these missions never got the accolades and recognition they deserved. Your website allows us to relive those missions and the excitement of them. Thank you for your fantastic website.

[Toma B]

So now UMSF is "a project of the Planetary Society"...well...whatever.
I just hope EVERYTHING will remain SAME AS BEFORE.

Now, can somebody/anybody at Planetary Society,UMSF,JPL or wherever try to find out what has happened to those RAW IMAGES from our beloved Mars rover Opportunity? It's been a week since last images were uploaded to either exploratorium or JPL MER site.

[Tesheiner]

Take it easy, man!

[tedstryk]

Toma B: It might be time to cut back on the coffee...

[stevesliva]

Ted, facebook is down! Can you/the tooth fairy fix it for me?

[tedstryk]

Sorry, Facebook is the responsibility of the Easter bunny.

[JohnVV]

Sorry, Facebook is the responsibility of the Easter bunny.

-- i like that ,Easter bunny --
never did like it , my daughter however can not live with out it
She also thinks it is "wired" that her aunt is on facebook . Guess it is a age thing

[ngunn]

I notice that there is now a link to planetary.org at the bottom of the page wherever you are in UMSF. That's great. It saves going out in the rain and walking round the block. But having made the journey through the internal door there seems to be no easy link back the other way. So it's out in the rain time, but guess what: I forgot my umbrella.

Just a friendly suggestion

[centsworth_II]

...having made the journey through the internal door there seems to be no easy link back the other way....

I just use the handy worm hole links in my bookmark toolbar to get where I need to through hyper- (or cyber-) space.

Guess where the gorilla on Mars icon leads me to.

[centsworth_II]

A lot of concern has been expressed about how UMSF(.com) would be affected by its association with The Planetary Society. Let's turn that around. Emily L. has frequently sung the praises of UMSF in her Planetary Society Blog. Now she has specifically recommended UMSF as a site worthy of being part of the Planetary Society family. All the more reason for "keeping UMSF at an 'impressively high level" .

In Emily's blog post which I link above, she says, "...at UMSF, you have to stay to the rules of conduct, keeping to the subject of robotic missions, and the data they return, and not post about forbidden topics or engage in antisocial behavior like trolling or ranting." I would add to the list of unacceptable behaviors 'overly social behavior' such as the off topic banter that recently broke out in one of the Opportunity forums and has since been mercifully removed.

[djellison]

A lot of concern has been expressed about how UMSF(.com) would be affected by its association with The Planetary Society.

To be honest, I just don't think that's true. There is not just cause for such concern, and because of that we've made it abundantly clear that things will change very very little, and because of that, people have not expressed much concern at all. Infact most people have used very very positive words indeed.

[centsworth_II]

...people have not expressed much concern at all. In fact most people have used very very positive words indeed.

Right. I should have said that there has been a lot of emphasis put on how the UMSF/TPS association will not affect UMSF while little concern has been expressed for how the association will reflect on TPS.

UMSF should be affected in that there should be additional pressure to 'keep up the high standards'.

[ElkGroveDan]

at UMSF, you have to stay to the rules of conduct, keeping to the subject of robotic missions, and the data they return, and not post about forbidden topics

As evidence that UMSF won't be changing content policies, some of UMSF's "forbidden topics" are, or have been, actual TPS projects. (For example one of them rhymes with "YETI.") This board simply has a narrower focus than the other TPS web sites, like different floors of a department store. After all if you were going shopping you wouldn't try to buy dog kennels in the mattress department.

So let's continue to celebrate this new relationship and everyone chill. The same old curmudgeons are still working the levers in the engine room. In fact I think I just saw Stu banging a wrench on a steam pipe down there.

[brellis]

erm, sorry about the McMansion post. I thot that was funnie

[ElkGroveDan]

Your McMansion in Woodland Hills is safe. Again if it was inappropriate, it would have been deleted. The junk drawer is just a place to move OT discussion when a thread is getting too cluttered. I even moved some of mine and Doug's comments.

[Stu]

In fact I think I just saw Stu banging a wrench on a steam pipe down there.

That I am Sir, that I am.

Ye cannae change the laws of UMSF...

[JohnVV]

i have always considered this site to be VERY professional ( more so than most) and as such , I treat it as such . ( way different than at shatters , or even LQ )
now there will ALWAYS be a bit of cross talk , and a very small amount is good . SO as long as WE HERE keep up with what we have already been doing . There will be no problems

and maybe the " more general public" site will get a bit more like this one

[Greg Hullender]

I think it's important to keep UMSF professional enough that actual scientists are comfortable posting here from time to time. In my mind, that's the #2 attraction of this board.

The brilliant amateur work on image processing is #1, of course. :-)

--Greg

[nprev]

An advanced planning question here. Us older heads remember the Phoenix landing on UMSF very well, including the traffic spike that began roughly 2 hrs. before EDL & peaked at somewhere around 273 users, most of whom were apparently first-time visitors. The new association with TPS could quite possibly double--or triple, or even quadruple--that number during the MSL landing less than two years from now. Are there any early notions about boosting server capacity in advance of the event, perhaps just temporarily by setting up redirects to mirrors for the duration (...if that made sense; not an IT guy), or throwing the discussion to a chat host (that could prove very difficult to moderate, or even follow coherently)?

Just askin'. It would be a real tragedy if we went down during the heat (ta dah, dah!) of EDL. The dialogue on UMSF during the Phoenix descent was one of the most enjoyable & memorable times on the forum for me, and I'd venture to guess also for many others; it would be terrible to not have something similar for Curiosity.

[djellison]

The server was explicitly over specified when we got it - it could handle 10x the traffic and none of you would notice. Indeed we had one hack-attack about a year or so ago that emulated hundreds of thousand of visits per hour, and nobody noticed a performance hit for 24 hrs.

Plus, adding mirrors is an exceptionally complex and expensive thing to do for database driven forums.

Every now and again we'll get massive temporary spikes in traffic, but we only know by looking at stats, nit wondering why the site is tuning slow.

[nprev]

Asked & answered, plus I learned something. Warm fuzzy achieved. Thanks, Doug!

[NMRguy]

Very interesting news, indeed! Thanks to all for years of interesting discussions, and looking forward to many more.

[cbcnasa]

UMSF is and has been a fantastic professional source for information to a casual follower, thank you so much.